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[Music]

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une pair cast the gold standard of

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paranormal radio enough here's Jim

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well neighbors some of you have been

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asking me about david bienick when's he

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gonna come back well here's the news

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ladies and gentlemen

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david has decided to return to civilian

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life he's gone back to his day job so we

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wish david the best of luck in his new

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pursuits our guest host again this week

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is Paul Kimble and you wrote a very

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fascinating post over at forum dr. Perik

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am the famous power cast community forum

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so I want to talk about and preface this

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Paul we had an episode a couple of weeks

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back featuring Frank Warren and Scott

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Ramsey about the Aztek case which

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obviously you know by and one of the

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points you raised was some background

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about Frank Scully now we all know Frank

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Scully was a variety columnist and a

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couple of things I read from him he

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seemed like a pretty straight guy but he

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had a pretty wacky background didn't he

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yeah I've been long running sort of

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tete-a-tete with Scott and Frank and

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Scott I worked on a film with him the

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Aztek 1948 film I actually made it back

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I think five or six years ago and

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they're very nice guys so it's not

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personal but I think they're just dead

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wrong about the Aztek case and so does

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pretty much everybody else has ever

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looked into it I've called the ethology

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Streck EULA because it seems to be the

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one case that you can stick a stake in

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it like JP Cohn did back in the 50s

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literally how can you get a bigger stake

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than you know the two guys that are

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perpetrating this thing are frauds and

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con men and the guy who's telling the

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story Frank Scully with a wink and a

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nudge is despite what Scott will say and

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he said it in the film sort of their

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version of the Peter Jennings Tom Brokaw

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dan Rather if their day when in fact

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it's probably more appropriate to call

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him the Pat O'Brien Glenn Beck Bill

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O'Reilly Jay Leno of his day you know

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kind of a bit of all of that stuff the

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man wasn't a journalist he was a gossip

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columnist he was a humorous reasonably

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decent writer when it came to stuff like

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that but to call Frank Scully a serious

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journalist is not just a stretch in

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logic

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patently false then there's nothing that

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can back that up

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but because so much of the Aztec case in

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a sense hangs on Scully's credibility as

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a person who could read

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Silas Newton and read Leo G Bauer and

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read these guys who could sift through

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the information who you know couldn't

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possibly have been fooled by these

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people I mean how could he be so

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gullible he was the Dan Rather or Peter

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Jennings of his day well they kind of

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need that in order to buttress their

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claims but it's just not true and so I

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did after I made the film and like any

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filmmaker you can make a film without

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agreeing with what either side says so

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in the film Scott gives his take on it

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but we also have Carl flocks at the lake

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Karl flock who's a good friend of mine

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sitting there saying well okay no look

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here's who Silas Newton really was

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here's who Leo Gbowee really was here's

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who Frank Scully really was here's how

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JP Khan and others exposed that and it

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was all hoax and a scam and the

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interesting thing Jean to digress for a

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little bit is Karl often had a

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reputation of being a debunker because

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he was one of the foremost proponents of

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the Mogul explanation for the Roswell

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case and he certainly was very vehement

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about Aztec being a hoax but Karl's

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point was often overlooked he said we'll

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look why would you talk about the Aztec

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case which was Buncombe when just down

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the road in Farmington New Mexico there

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was a case in 1950 the so-called

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Farmington Armada which karl took very

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seriously where dozens of people

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reported i guess the only way you could

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describe it would be a fleet of strange

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craft or something UFOs flying over the

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town of Farmington and then it was

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reported in another section of the state

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Las Vegas Nevada but Las Vegas New

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Mexico by other people shortly

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thereafter so Karl far from being a

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debunker was a guy who said look no I

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believe in good UFO cases he thought the

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Farmington case was a good UFO case but

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his problem was that cases like Aztec

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would come along the sexy flying saucer

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crashed bodies recovered case and with

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very little or no evidence you know

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people would get sucked into that and it

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would distract them from good solid UFO

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cases which is

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by Carl and I get along so well the one

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thing here about Aztec and this is what

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has to be if we take that book behind

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the flying saucers out of the picture

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and Frank Scully never existed

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is there an Aztec UFO case obviously

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Frank Warren and Scott Ramsey will say

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well they interviewed witnesses in Aztec

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New Mexico that gave them information

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that corroborated everything they would

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say that of course but I would encourage

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people to go to my blog read star films

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blog spot.com go back to 2005 when I

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wrote an awful lot about the Aztec case

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because Scott is not the first guy did

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Eden magically rediscover Aztec in the

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1990s after it had lied dead for forty

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years various other people had brought

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the Aztec case back to life again

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ufologist Dracula the most notorious of

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which was a guy named William Steinman

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who wrote a huge book called UFO crash

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at Aztec in the 1980s and what Steinman

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did is he and I carry with the exact how

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he got on to the Aztec case but he went

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as tech he did basically what Scott is

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saying he did went around interviewed a

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whole bunch of people stirred up a

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hornet's nest frankly ticked a few

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people off too and if you read the book

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and you go through it I wrote a series I

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think a four-part series on William

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Simon's research a fair bit of which

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mirrors the kind of research that Scott

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and I presume Frank have done in the

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last say 10 years and you can see the

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flaws not only in his research

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methodology but in his conclusions it's

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clear that he was a believer who was

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looking to find he found the answer that

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he was looking to find so where's the

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witnesses then you go I would encourage

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people to go to the it's 2005 you can

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find in my archive section witnesses

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like Fred Reed and Scott used to and I

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honestly haven't talked to Scott in a

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couple years I don't know if he still

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does but he used to tout a guy named

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Fred Reed as a credible witness and

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people bandy that term witness around

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witness means you saw the Flying Saucer

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none of these people were witnesses what

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they were defend were people who had

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heard the story or were aware of some

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aspect of the story so they're not true

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witnesses there

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can hand witnesses to the story if you

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will anyway he claimed that Reid was an

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actual witness though and I deconstruct

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Fred Reid's story in about you know a

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page and a half or two pages worth of

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text and it's something that a basic you

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know investigation 101 if you were

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looking at it objectively there should

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have been immediately red flags raised

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with a guy like Fred Reid or other

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people and again it's the same kind of

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thing that's happened in Roswell it's

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what Karl did with Roswell you hear

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these claims of dozens or hundreds of

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witnesses and yet when you actually go

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through and you say well look let's line

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these witnesses up and let's look at

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them individually case by case what did

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they witness are they credible you know

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does this story hold up all of a sudden

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the hundreds of witnesses or the dozens

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of witnesses get whittled down to well

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okay maybe two or three witnesses and in

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Roswell or maybe five or six the key is

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here palm to kind of know there's no

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witness as an Aztek that's okay that's

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the key the key is you're taking a

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handful of witnesses a handful of

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witnesses and a bunch of people who say

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we heard what they heard where they said

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this to me but in the case of Aztec you

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say there's no direct witness to this

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crash or this landing whatever it was

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name one I would say to Scott or to

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Frank name one credible proven witness

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who saw anything anyone give me a name

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that we can track down that we can check

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ourselves Fred Reed was one that Scott

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floated a few years ago I checked and

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that's not a credible story so I suppose

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all we can do is wait for Scott's book

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but you know Scott's been writing that

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book for seven or eight years now and

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eventually you know published or parish

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put up or shut up

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so you carry this case on you do radio

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appearances and conference appearances

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and aztecs been around for 60 years I

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can't see how they're uncomforted hasn't

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been uncovered before so I think it's

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probably time for Scott to actually

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publish this book and say here's what

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I've got and it's either good or it's

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bad I'm sure it's bad because I'm pretty

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I know what he's got but put it out

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there instead of just showing up on a

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radio show and

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keeping the same stories that have been

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told for 60 years and if that sounds

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harsh I'm sorry but it's not the case

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with a lot of these cases here we have

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this ancient history and the same is

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true with Roswell we have a handful of

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witnesses direct witnesses so-called

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direct witnesses a lot of indirect

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witnesses a lot of second-hand stuff

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people remembering what has passed

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through the telling the retelling of 50

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60 years there's no hope is there that

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we'll ever get to the bottom of that

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well I think in the case of Aztec we got

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to the bottom of a long time ago and so

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all they're trying to do is dredge up in

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case that was dead back in the 1950s in

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the case of Roswell Roswell is a little

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more complicated than Aztec I mean Aztec

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is opening shot unless you desperately

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want to believe

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Roswell there's still a hint I think

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even for skeptics that something

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happened at Roswell it might not have

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been aliens from Zeta Reticuli but maybe

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something crashed there there was some

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secrecy perhaps even a cover up whatever

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was mogul its top secret government

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experiment of snick red friends posited

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or you know Stan Friedman's aliens who

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knows and so assuming we don't have the

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answer yet or assuming the answers there

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but 60 or 80 percent of the people don't

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accept it as Nick Redfern once said to

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me and I agree with them all heartedly

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we'll never know you're quite right Jean

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Roswell has now drifted into the realm

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of legend and myth it is you follow geez

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Camelot King Arthur Robin Hood whatever

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you want to call it and there's nothing

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more to be gleaned there all that people

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00:10:40,410 --> 00:10:38,500
are doing is arguing over things that

271
00:10:42,750 --> 00:10:40,420
have been it out there for 30 years

272
00:10:45,389 --> 00:10:42,760
the the Ramey memo is a perfect example

273
00:10:47,310 --> 00:10:45,399
guys like David Rudy AK argued with

274
00:10:49,410 --> 00:10:47,320
other people about the Ramey Men memo

275
00:10:52,380 --> 00:10:49,420
and they've been arguing about that for

276
00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:52,390
20 or 30 years and they're never going

277
00:10:57,030 --> 00:10:54,970
to change each other's minds so it's

278
00:10:58,860 --> 00:10:57,040
time for you follow G to get out of the

279
00:10:59,550 --> 00:10:58,870
time-warp it's like being caught on a

280
00:11:01,380 --> 00:10:59,560
Star Trek

281
00:11:02,970 --> 00:11:01,390
temporal loops where you just keep

282
00:11:05,130 --> 00:11:02,980
repeating the day over and over and over

283
00:11:06,949 --> 00:11:05,140
again eventually you have to get the

284
00:11:09,810 --> 00:11:06,959
enterprise out of the temporal loop

285
00:11:12,569 --> 00:11:09,820
it'll be Groundhog Day where the Murray

286
00:11:15,269 --> 00:11:12,579
has to become a mensch before the day

287
00:11:16,940 --> 00:11:15,279
ever ends we have to mention Phi F ology

288
00:11:19,580 --> 00:11:16,950
exactly okay so

289
00:11:21,710 --> 00:11:19,590
my apology and then we'll stop talking

290
00:11:23,300 --> 00:11:21,720
about Roswell stop talking about Azteca

291
00:11:25,580 --> 00:11:23,310
and I'll tell you the reason I even

292
00:11:27,260 --> 00:11:25,590
brought the subject in talking with

293
00:11:29,300 --> 00:11:27,270
Frank Warren about guest hosting some

294
00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:29,310
episodes and he'll be doing more the

295
00:11:33,860 --> 00:11:31,050
reason I brought up this particular one

296
00:11:35,690 --> 00:11:33,870
is because we had Kevin Randle on the

297
00:11:37,070 --> 00:11:35,700
show Kevin Randall put it down I said

298
00:11:39,380 --> 00:11:37,080
well okay well Kevin Randall's saying

299
00:11:41,390 --> 00:11:39,390
there's nothing to it let's get the

300
00:11:42,470 --> 00:11:41,400
people who think otherwise to express

301
00:11:45,290 --> 00:11:42,480
their point of view

302
00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:45,300
give them their two hours and then let

303
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:46,650
the chips fall where they may and

304
00:11:51,380 --> 00:11:48,930
certainly we know where you stand okay

305
00:11:53,180 --> 00:11:51,390
Paul Campbell who do you have in store

306
00:11:54,890 --> 00:11:53,190
for us on this week's episode we're

307
00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:54,900
doing an episode oh I thought this was

308
00:11:59,000 --> 00:11:56,370
just a short little hit and then I was

309
00:12:01,310 --> 00:11:59,010
gonna oh gosh yeah you know what you

310
00:12:03,740 --> 00:12:01,320
have to sit down just take a hot tea oh

311
00:12:06,590 --> 00:12:03,750
no and I know it gets kind of cold in

312
00:12:08,420 --> 00:12:06,600
Nova Scotia this time of year so have

313
00:12:11,330 --> 00:12:08,430
some tea a little bit of a kung pao

314
00:12:15,310 --> 00:12:11,340
chicken kung pao chicken nice you dig

315
00:12:19,580 --> 00:12:17,360
we have a friend of mine a fellow

316
00:12:21,950 --> 00:12:19,590
filmmaker this is my attempt to do David

317
00:12:22,850 --> 00:12:21,960
B&E humor and it clearly doesn't work we

318
00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:22,860
have a friend of mine named Mike

319
00:12:26,510 --> 00:12:24,450
McDonald who's a filmmaker here in

320
00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:26,520
Halifax Nova Scotia and now he's a into

321
00:12:30,950 --> 00:12:28,410
the singer who works with that band and

322
00:12:33,050 --> 00:12:30,960
from LA no and he's done a number of

323
00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:33,060
documentaries about the UFO phenomena

324
00:12:39,590 --> 00:12:36,330
and and and the paranormal two including

325
00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:39,600
the Antichrist he's done a TV piece on

326
00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:42,210
the Antichrist so all sorts of things to

327
00:12:47,300 --> 00:12:44,730
talk to Mike about tonight and he knew

328
00:12:49,670 --> 00:12:47,310
forry ackerman he did and he did the

329
00:12:52,430 --> 00:12:49,680
definitive documentary on forry ackerman

330
00:12:55,070 --> 00:12:52,440
just before Ackerman passed away famous

331
00:12:57,530 --> 00:12:55,080
monster the forry ackerman story yes fj

332
00:12:59,690 --> 00:12:57,540
the Acker monster I knew him I told Mike

333
00:13:02,060 --> 00:12:59,700
that he's I think Mike's is interested

334
00:13:04,580 --> 00:13:02,070
to talk to you as you might be to talk

335
00:13:06,980 --> 00:13:04,590
to him VESA v40 Ackerman because he's a

336
00:13:09,199 --> 00:13:06,990
huge huge fan coming up next on the

337
00:13:11,780 --> 00:13:09,209
power cast

338
00:13:13,730 --> 00:13:11,790
we're not in Kansas anymore hi this is

339
00:13:15,470 --> 00:13:13,740
tomorrow from Namecheap where our domain

340
00:13:17,359 --> 00:13:15,480
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00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:29,249
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348
00:13:31,879 --> 00:13:29,850
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349
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350
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351
00:13:37,790 --> 00:13:35,850
your support means so much to us if

352
00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:37,800
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353
00:13:42,590 --> 00:13:40,290
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354
00:13:43,939 --> 00:13:42,600
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355
00:13:49,429 --> 00:13:43,949
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356
00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:49,439
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357
00:13:57,049 --> 00:13:51,569
facebook.com slash named chief see you

358
00:13:58,489 --> 00:13:57,059
online we want to hear from you if you

359
00:14:01,699 --> 00:13:58,499
have a comment or question about the

360
00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:01,709
pair cast send it to news at the podcast

361
00:14:05,749 --> 00:14:02,490
com

362
00:14:07,639 --> 00:14:05,759
that's news at the podcast calm and

363
00:14:09,350 --> 00:14:07,649
don't forget to visit our forums where

364
00:14:11,900 --> 00:14:09,360
you can talk to fellow listeners just go

365
00:14:14,389 --> 00:14:11,910
to the para cast comm and click on the

366
00:14:23,290 --> 00:14:14,399
forum links that's the forum links at

367
00:14:57,070 --> 00:14:38,970
[Music]

368
00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:00,110
Michael McDonald filmmaker you knew

369
00:15:04,820 --> 00:15:02,490
forry ackerman in his final years so let

370
00:15:06,770 --> 00:15:04,830
me tell you about my forry ackerman

371
00:15:09,230 --> 00:15:06,780
stories I was a reader of Famous

372
00:15:12,530 --> 00:15:09,240
Monsters of Filmland many many years ago

373
00:15:14,390 --> 00:15:12,540
and they had this contest forry ackerman

374
00:15:16,100 --> 00:15:14,400
is traveling around the country you

375
00:15:18,350 --> 00:15:16,110
write a letter explain why you want

376
00:15:19,250 --> 00:15:18,360
forry ackerman to come to your home even

377
00:15:21,290 --> 00:15:19,260
have a little you know a little

378
00:15:23,570 --> 00:15:21,300
gathering with other readers of the

379
00:15:26,510 --> 00:15:23,580
magazine and i did and they called me

380
00:15:29,390 --> 00:15:26,520
and said he's coming and so i set up

381
00:15:31,220 --> 00:15:29,400
like a radio talk show with a bank of

382
00:15:33,380 --> 00:15:31,230
microphones an old-fashioned analogue

383
00:15:35,060 --> 00:15:33,390
tape recorder perfectly decent guy

384
00:15:36,710 --> 00:15:35,070
I think his publisher may have been with

385
00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:36,720
him at the time Jim Warren where I met

386
00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:39,450
him in other circumstances but anyway we

387
00:15:44,300 --> 00:15:42,210
had a pleasant couple of hours pleasant

388
00:15:46,370 --> 00:15:44,310
lunch and a few years later I was a

389
00:15:47,750 --> 00:15:46,380
commercial radio broadcaster but that's

390
00:15:49,970 --> 00:15:47,760
where it all began and now you know the

391
00:15:53,150 --> 00:15:49,980
rest of the story tell us you are forry

392
00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:53,160
ackerman story uncle Rory actually I

393
00:15:57,190 --> 00:15:54,810
didn't read famous monster to come win

394
00:16:00,080 --> 00:15:57,200
when I was younger I am you know and

395
00:16:01,370 --> 00:16:00,090
probably look through one that at the

396
00:16:03,010 --> 00:16:01,380
store but I never actually bought one

397
00:16:05,300 --> 00:16:03,020
but I wasn't a monster movies

398
00:16:07,220 --> 00:16:05,310
particularly in the Frankenstein and

399
00:16:09,070 --> 00:16:07,230
Dracula or the Universal Pictures and

400
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:09,080
some of the newer stuff too at the time

401
00:16:13,670 --> 00:16:11,130
talking about the late sixties early

402
00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:13,680
seventies but it was actually in I did a

403
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:15,210
film called visions from the edge the

404
00:16:19,310 --> 00:16:17,010
art of science fiction tonight and I

405
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:19,320
went out and I found people who were

406
00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:22,170
doing cover for books and posters in the

407
00:16:26,150 --> 00:16:24,330
science fiction genre and I wanted to

408
00:16:28,550 --> 00:16:26,160
break the documentary up and somebody

409
00:16:30,310 --> 00:16:28,560
had written my friend Ian Johnson and my

410
00:16:32,019 --> 00:16:30,320
filmmaking partner Ian Johnson

411
00:16:34,780 --> 00:16:32,029
it suggested forry ackerman's me because

412
00:16:36,819 --> 00:16:34,790
he had no Nefarian with monster so I

413
00:16:38,860 --> 00:16:36,829
actually had him in the film it's

414
00:16:40,780 --> 00:16:38,870
showing his collection of sci-fi art and

415
00:16:42,819 --> 00:16:40,790
of course the other memorabilia before

416
00:16:45,850 --> 00:16:42,829
even really I really had a clear idea of

417
00:16:47,620 --> 00:16:45,860
who he was it wasn't until a couple

418
00:16:50,199 --> 00:16:47,630
years later that I actually made a film

419
00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:50,209
about what should we know about forry

420
00:16:54,550 --> 00:16:52,130
ackerman he actually had a paranormal

421
00:16:56,889 --> 00:16:54,560
experience one or two during his

422
00:16:59,850 --> 00:16:56,899
lifetime didn't he I don't know but for

423
00:17:02,860 --> 00:16:59,860
he was always very circumspect about the

424
00:17:05,230 --> 00:17:02,870
paranormal and he like science fiction

425
00:17:07,809 --> 00:17:05,240
he liked the stories he liked the idea

426
00:17:10,090 --> 00:17:07,819
of space platforms on the moon and

427
00:17:12,549 --> 00:17:10,100
rocket ships he liked the idea of

428
00:17:15,189 --> 00:17:12,559
monsters but when it came to the

429
00:17:17,500 --> 00:17:15,199
afterlife in peril for he didn't say a

430
00:17:19,990 --> 00:17:17,510
lot at least to me he didn't believe in

431
00:17:22,990 --> 00:17:20,000
the afterlife which I found kind of

432
00:17:26,500 --> 00:17:23,000
striking and odd considering for his

433
00:17:28,630 --> 00:17:26,510
otherwise extremely outgoing and and

434
00:17:30,310 --> 00:17:28,640
permissive view of the world let me name

435
00:17:32,980 --> 00:17:30,320
is stéphanie just a guy you know for his

436
00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:32,990
feet Esperanto yes I did yes along with

437
00:17:37,510 --> 00:17:35,330
William Shatner there's a few people on

438
00:17:39,430 --> 00:17:37,520
this planet know what Esperanto is

439
00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:39,440
anymore I know my first wife could speak

440
00:17:46,419 --> 00:17:44,720
Esperanto so 4e was a big fan of Incubus

441
00:17:47,770 --> 00:17:46,429
then that was the film Shatner did

442
00:17:50,020 --> 00:17:47,780
wasn't it that where they did the whole

443
00:17:55,090 --> 00:17:50,030
thing in Esperanto it was an incubus I

444
00:17:57,490 --> 00:17:55,100
think it was he quoted to me where lying

445
00:18:01,659 --> 00:17:57,500
beautiful lines from The Invisible Man

446
00:18:02,649 --> 00:18:01,669
and from Frankenstein anyway I had him

447
00:18:04,630 --> 00:18:02,659
in this film I thought it was a

448
00:18:07,210 --> 00:18:04,640
wonderful guy and I did have a good idea

449
00:18:09,700 --> 00:18:07,220
of who he was but Ian Johnston in

450
00:18:11,110 --> 00:18:09,710
Toronto he's my writing partner and a

451
00:18:13,750 --> 00:18:11,120
filmmaking partner

452
00:18:14,799 --> 00:18:13,760
we both did famous monster Forrest J

453
00:18:17,100 --> 00:18:14,809
Ackerman together

454
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:17,110
Ian knew a lot more about Corey and

455
00:18:21,460 --> 00:18:19,610
educated me on for Ian became tricks and

456
00:18:24,100 --> 00:18:21,470
I had many trips before his place even a

457
00:18:25,690 --> 00:18:24,110
house of pies and we've had I've watched

458
00:18:28,530 --> 00:18:25,700
40 pick a party a couple of hamburgers

459
00:18:30,970 --> 00:18:28,540
my god so I got to know him more on a

460
00:18:33,250 --> 00:18:30,980
you know oh you're the very interesting

461
00:18:34,510 --> 00:18:33,260
guy and he was very respectful to be and

462
00:18:36,730 --> 00:18:34,520
know where we were absolutely making

463
00:18:38,350 --> 00:18:36,740
this film but in a way it was just sort

464
00:18:39,669 --> 00:18:38,360
of for him it was a natural thing he

465
00:18:41,110 --> 00:18:39,679
didn't make a big deal about it it's

466
00:18:43,330 --> 00:18:41,120
like okay you're here you making a phone

467
00:18:47,169 --> 00:18:43,340
bumping let's go eat and

468
00:18:48,940 --> 00:18:47,179
the quarry iPad um it's sad while you

469
00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:48,950
were talking Mike I checked on the the

470
00:18:52,239 --> 00:18:50,450
internet and what said is I'm such a

471
00:18:54,610 --> 00:18:52,249
William Shatner fan that I actually was

472
00:18:56,379 --> 00:18:54,620
right I know the name of the film that

473
00:19:01,330 --> 00:18:56,389
he was in where he spoke Esperanto it's

474
00:19:05,350 --> 00:19:01,340
it's this 1965 black and white classic

475
00:19:07,060 --> 00:19:05,360
and I use the term class yeah no it's

476
00:19:09,039 --> 00:19:07,070
it's it's actually kind of fun but they

477
00:19:10,389 --> 00:19:09,049
do it pretty much all in Esperanto so

478
00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:10,399
I'm sure Ackerman would have known about

479
00:19:15,129 --> 00:19:13,610
it my sort of question to you is I

480
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:15,139
remember seeing your film and I'm pretty

481
00:19:23,919 --> 00:19:18,970
sure I saw this didn't he have a full

482
00:19:26,710 --> 00:19:23,929
Cylon warrior in his house wasn't a

483
00:19:28,690 --> 00:19:26,720
Cylon and it's great and get on this

484
00:19:30,369 --> 00:19:28,700
it's actually a different robot from a

485
00:19:32,889 --> 00:19:30,379
different film that although it does

486
00:19:35,590 --> 00:19:32,899
resemble a Cylon and yes he didn't have

487
00:19:37,239 --> 00:19:35,600
it there okay cuz not Robbie the robot

488
00:19:41,649 --> 00:19:37,249
from Forbidden Planet

489
00:19:44,109 --> 00:19:41,659
no but he did have but he did have a

490
00:19:45,549 --> 00:19:44,119
drink in his chair which he M guiltily

491
00:19:49,889 --> 00:19:45,559
went and sat a World War II wasn't

492
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:49,899
looking and of course he had the

493
00:19:55,810 --> 00:19:53,210
Dracula's ring which by the way is in

494
00:19:58,539 --> 00:19:55,820
Halifax and owned by a local sculptor

495
00:20:01,539 --> 00:19:58,549
actually world renowned sculptor do I

496
00:20:03,609 --> 00:20:01,549
work for the White House I actually saw

497
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:03,619
this ring I see this very more than once

498
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:05,330
not on for his finger because he had it

499
00:20:13,239 --> 00:20:10,850
in the glass well I did see him Eric

500
00:20:16,090 --> 00:20:13,249
when he visited us in New York he was

501
00:20:18,489 --> 00:20:16,100
wearing it and that's weird do you

502
00:20:20,350 --> 00:20:18,499
mention that because we'll know in fact

503
00:20:22,149 --> 00:20:20,360
David manners the actor who played

504
00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:22,159
Jonathan Harker in the original Dracula

505
00:20:33,879 --> 00:20:32,570
was originally from Halifax that was the

506
00:20:35,230 --> 00:20:33,889
great thing about making this film I

507
00:20:36,999 --> 00:20:35,240
can't talk enough with the things about

508
00:20:39,730 --> 00:20:37,009
this guy where she was on the show but

509
00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:39,740
this guy knows Hollywood and and he had

510
00:20:43,509 --> 00:20:41,450
a particularly love of horror and sci-fi

511
00:20:45,940 --> 00:20:43,519
and it's because of our collaboration

512
00:20:48,639 --> 00:20:45,950
that we knew were the only people to

513
00:20:51,039 --> 00:20:48,649
make a film about four Ackerman

514
00:20:53,409 --> 00:20:51,049
exclusively and have a broadcast and we

515
00:20:56,190 --> 00:20:53,419
get it before he died and it's sort of a

516
00:20:58,799 --> 00:20:56,200
it's sort of a bittersweet

517
00:21:00,930 --> 00:20:58,809
and I'm glad that I was I sort of was

518
00:21:02,879 --> 00:21:00,940
the last one to serve film him in his

519
00:21:04,529 --> 00:21:02,889
last days and he was told by other crews

520
00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:04,539
for different purposes but they could do

521
00:21:09,330 --> 00:21:06,850
an entire film on him and you know

522
00:21:11,609 --> 00:21:09,340
here's the funny stories those who know

523
00:21:13,739 --> 00:21:11,619
out there in radioland forest actor they

524
00:21:16,409 --> 00:21:13,749
know that he was the congenial uncle of

525
00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:16,419
science fiction horror an editor of a

526
00:21:20,700 --> 00:21:18,970
magazine that people that kids would be

527
00:21:22,859 --> 00:21:20,710
able to write in like Joe Dante wrote a

528
00:21:26,789 --> 00:21:22,869
piece of the 50 worst film dude ever

529
00:21:29,369 --> 00:21:26,799
seen in his life before he turned the

530
00:21:32,099 --> 00:21:29,379
venue and article so he took care of

531
00:21:36,149 --> 00:21:32,109
these young minds like Stephen King and

532
00:21:38,909 --> 00:21:36,159
George Lucas and David show and and and

533
00:21:40,769 --> 00:21:38,919
and Roebuck and all these great

534
00:21:43,710 --> 00:21:40,779
filmmakers and actors that are out there

535
00:21:45,989 --> 00:21:43,720
right now he there's a big influence in

536
00:21:49,019 --> 00:21:45,999
their life mostly by the simple fact

537
00:21:51,749 --> 00:21:49,029
that he was a very kind man who really

538
00:21:54,749 --> 00:21:51,759
loved people's enthusiasm that matched

539
00:21:57,509 --> 00:21:54,759
his or any kind of enthusiasm and was

540
00:22:00,509 --> 00:21:57,519
its very humble and always welcomed them

541
00:22:02,460 --> 00:22:00,519
into his life in his house that's the

542
00:22:05,159 --> 00:22:02,470
man for sacrum it just happened to be

543
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:05,169
side by heart now did you ever ask him

544
00:22:09,389 --> 00:22:07,450
about the because you've made a number

545
00:22:11,580 --> 00:22:09,399
of films about the UFO phenomenon and

546
00:22:13,979 --> 00:22:11,590
had before you made the the Ackerman

547
00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:13,989
film did you ever talk to him or ask him

548
00:22:18,330 --> 00:22:16,330
about what he thought of the UFO

549
00:22:21,769 --> 00:22:18,340
phenomenon because there's always been a

550
00:22:24,930 --> 00:22:21,779
very and best not it well yeah sometimes

551
00:22:26,609 --> 00:22:24,940
antagonistic but a leery relationship is

552
00:22:30,269 --> 00:22:26,619
sort of standoffish relationship between

553
00:22:31,919 --> 00:22:30,279
science fiction and ufology ufologists

554
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:31,929
so did you did you ever talk to him

555
00:22:35,369 --> 00:22:34,210
about the UFO phenomenon well yeah in a

556
00:22:38,129 --> 00:22:35,379
roundabout way we talked about

557
00:22:40,529 --> 00:22:38,139
Scientology and l ron Hubbard and that

558
00:22:42,180 --> 00:22:40,539
was a supposed to be God and of course

559
00:22:45,690 --> 00:22:42,190
you know he told us the story this in my

560
00:22:48,239 --> 00:22:45,700
film that Elrond for 140 bucks and for

561
00:22:50,909 --> 00:22:48,249
Eve acting like like he will be

562
00:22:52,950 --> 00:22:50,919
something and continued to not pay him

563
00:22:55,590 --> 00:22:52,960
back and even to the point where for he

564
00:22:57,210 --> 00:22:55,600
went up to him when what Elrond was with

565
00:22:58,830 --> 00:22:57,220
tiny copies of his book and he said

566
00:23:00,299 --> 00:22:58,840
before he says you know what I'm bigger

567
00:23:01,919 --> 00:23:00,309
than Clark Gable importance and well

568
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:01,929
good you can pay me the 40 bucks and say

569
00:23:10,380 --> 00:23:08,700
by the way you've exposed the

570
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:10,390
scientology movement ladies and

571
00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:14,170
gentlemen we're going to be attacked Tom

572
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:16,690
Cruise is going to go on my couch he's

573
00:23:27,540 --> 00:23:19,210
going to jump up and scream at the top

574
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:27,550
of his lungs I've done the same thing

575
00:23:30,570 --> 00:23:29,290
they say would you like a knee meter

576
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:30,580
reading or whatever it is I remember

577
00:23:34,230 --> 00:23:32,410
Greg Bischoff and walk by walking down

578
00:23:36,750 --> 00:23:34,240
and this is this very nice girl with

579
00:23:38,490 --> 00:23:36,760
stuck her thing up and said do you like

580
00:23:41,130 --> 00:23:38,500
a free personal reading or whatever and

581
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:41,140
I said hey look lady if I wanted to hang

582
00:23:47,700 --> 00:23:42,610
out with the cult I'd go hang out with

583
00:23:49,410 --> 00:23:47,710
the Moonies was like appalled for about

584
00:23:51,090 --> 00:23:49,420
a second until he we got away and he

585
00:23:53,340 --> 00:23:51,100
said you don't talk to them like that

586
00:23:55,290 --> 00:23:53,350
here that's still following it I think I

587
00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:55,300
was just so rude she kind of just ignore

588
00:23:58,470 --> 00:23:57,010
discipline yeah yeah it's like they're

589
00:24:00,240 --> 00:23:58,480
all over the place you can't walk down

590
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:00,250
Hollywood Boulevard without running into

591
00:24:04,530 --> 00:24:02,290
them so that forty bucks probably was

592
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:04,540
what Hubbard used to start that was the

593
00:24:10,620 --> 00:24:07,330
grubstake for Scientology so God knows I

594
00:24:12,900 --> 00:24:10,630
mean for Atlanta for a game $30 to Ray

595
00:24:15,090 --> 00:24:12,910
Bradbury to go to the very first world

596
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:15,100
college science fiction at conference in

597
00:24:19,290 --> 00:24:17,530
New York and Ray Bradbury took the train

598
00:24:21,660 --> 00:24:19,300
all the way to New York 40 kids in that

599
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:21,670
money this guy forry ackerman I can't

600
00:24:26,610 --> 00:24:23,410
say enough about you Forrest J Ackerman

601
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:26,620
no died after the J as he would say Jane

602
00:24:31,590 --> 00:24:28,890
Stanford Jehovah here Y Whitman

603
00:24:33,890 --> 00:24:31,600
he had this fabulous Museum of

604
00:24:36,299 --> 00:24:33,900
memorabilia in his home in Los Angeles

605
00:24:38,730 --> 00:24:36,309
after he died what happened to that

606
00:24:40,620 --> 00:24:38,740
stuff it was taken care of by the estate

607
00:24:43,020 --> 00:24:40,630
a partition and then auctioned off

608
00:24:46,260 --> 00:24:43,030
chunks that were auctioned off or he had

609
00:24:49,140 --> 00:24:46,270
a list of 99 I think or you know what I

610
00:24:51,750 --> 00:24:49,150
don't know could be 26 but was talked

611
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:51,760
about at the memorial that was at the

612
00:24:56,820 --> 00:24:54,730
Egyptian theater March last year some

613
00:24:58,110 --> 00:24:56,830
people were directly given stuff other

614
00:25:00,240 --> 00:24:58,120
stuff was auctioned off like for example

615
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:00,250
the ring which ended up actually in the

616
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:02,890
hands of the Halifax doctor interesting

617
00:25:07,919 --> 00:25:05,170
some of it is on eBay there's lots of

618
00:25:09,570 --> 00:25:07,929
stuff on eBay and my partner is smashing

619
00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:09,580
stuff up little bits and pieces here and

620
00:25:14,550 --> 00:25:11,770
there on either he has actually forced

621
00:25:16,770 --> 00:25:14,560
for his birth certificate which I

622
00:25:18,310 --> 00:25:16,780
believe has Clarke written as his middle

623
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:18,320
name is some confusion by the middle

624
00:25:24,009 --> 00:25:20,570
but he basically picked up all of that

625
00:25:25,990 --> 00:25:24,019
stuff or from your film I got at least a

626
00:25:27,940 --> 00:25:26,000
lot of that stuff which now you know we

627
00:25:29,799 --> 00:25:27,950
would sort of say this is amazing

628
00:25:32,110 --> 00:25:29,809
memorabilia worth a lot of money but he

629
00:25:34,090 --> 00:25:32,120
just picked it up if not quite out of

630
00:25:35,350 --> 00:25:34,100
the trash bin people were throwing this

631
00:25:39,820 --> 00:25:35,360
stuff away because they didn't have it

632
00:25:42,159 --> 00:25:39,830
well you do it same thing is from the

633
00:25:44,470 --> 00:25:42,169
edge a lot of the older pieces of

634
00:25:46,330 --> 00:25:44,480
artwork you know some of this beautiful

635
00:25:48,129 --> 00:25:46,340
classical stuff now what you know

636
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:48,139
literally found in dumpsters or open

637
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:50,330
attics and it's considered to be kind of

638
00:26:01,850 --> 00:25:53,450
trifles like that and our treasures Wow

639
00:26:09,100 --> 00:26:05,070
[Music]

640
00:26:11,230 --> 00:26:09,110
is there a secret UFO agenda to strange

641
00:26:13,750 --> 00:26:11,240
creatures from the darkest corners of

642
00:26:16,510 --> 00:26:13,760
the mind roam the earth is there

643
00:26:19,870 --> 00:26:16,520
evidence for mind control time travel or

644
00:26:21,490 --> 00:26:19,880
devious government conspiracies find out

645
00:26:24,490 --> 00:26:21,500
the inside scoop on the latest

646
00:26:26,740 --> 00:26:24,500
conspiracies Paranormal Activity and at

647
00:26:29,530 --> 00:26:26,750
40 in phenomenon when you subscribe to

648
00:26:32,350 --> 00:26:29,540
Tim Beckley's conspiracy girl it's

649
00:26:35,020 --> 00:26:32,360
jam-packed with stories special book and

650
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:35,030
DVD promotions and the best news it's

651
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:37,250
absolutely free sent right to your

652
00:26:43,780 --> 00:26:40,250
mailbox plus a bonus free email

653
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:43,790
newsletter sent out every Friday simply

654
00:26:50,620 --> 00:26:45,650
send an email with your name and address

655
00:26:55,300 --> 00:26:50,630
to Mister UFO at web TV net attached mr.

656
00:27:02,190 --> 00:26:55,310
UFO at web TV net find out what they

657
00:27:07,669 --> 00:27:04,619
I've dispel options and you're listening

658
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:07,679
to the power cast and I completely

659
00:27:11,879 --> 00:27:10,330
unsuited ly endorses program it's an

660
00:27:14,060 --> 00:27:11,889
absolutely great program with

661
00:27:16,769 --> 00:27:14,070
opportunities to stretch out and talk

662
00:27:18,539 --> 00:27:16,779
we're talking on the fire grass with

663
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:18,549
Michael McDonald on special guest houses

664
00:27:22,529 --> 00:27:21,129
Paul Kimball and we're talking to my

665
00:27:25,109 --> 00:27:22,539
friends north of the border

666
00:27:27,269 --> 00:27:25,119
Michael is a documentary filmmaker he

667
00:27:29,519 --> 00:27:27,279
did of course the one about Forrest J

668
00:27:32,009 --> 00:27:29,529
Ackerman the famous monster himself

669
00:27:34,470 --> 00:27:32,019
someone I knew just very slightly when I

670
00:27:36,690 --> 00:27:34,480
was much much much younger but he's also

671
00:27:38,970 --> 00:27:36,700
done a number of films about UFOs and

672
00:27:41,639 --> 00:27:38,980
the paranormal and the courts of making

673
00:27:45,269 --> 00:27:41,649
those films he also came to know a dear

674
00:27:48,330 --> 00:27:45,279
departed friend of ours Mac Tony's tell

675
00:27:51,479 --> 00:27:48,340
us about Mac Tony's Mac Tony's well Mac

676
00:27:55,049 --> 00:27:51,489
Tony's God rest his soul is a wonderful

677
00:27:57,899 --> 00:27:55,059
guy I think he died at what 34 yes 34

678
00:27:59,489 --> 00:27:57,909
years old I'm a heart attack I spent two

679
00:28:01,739 --> 00:27:59,499
years ago I spent a summer with him

680
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:01,749
traveling around the southwest as well

681
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:03,369
as the San Francisco area and mountain

682
00:28:10,470 --> 00:28:06,730
dew shooting an episode of TV series

683
00:28:12,659 --> 00:28:10,480
produced by vision Network produced for

684
00:28:15,629 --> 00:28:12,669
vision Network in Canada called

685
00:28:17,340 --> 00:28:15,639
Supernatural investigative and that

686
00:28:19,499 --> 00:28:17,350
particular episode we were shooting was

687
00:28:21,090 --> 00:28:19,509
called life from other planets the

688
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:21,100
original premise of the series was be

689
00:28:27,180 --> 00:28:21,730
believed in

690
00:28:27,930 --> 00:28:27,190
other planets not on other planets from

691
00:28:30,180 --> 00:28:27,940
other planets

692
00:28:32,369 --> 00:28:30,190
so it was inclusive so Mac was

693
00:28:34,470 --> 00:28:32,379
recommended to me actually by Paul and

694
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:34,480
I'd asked Paul if he wanted to be the

695
00:28:39,749 --> 00:28:36,369
investigator that would sort of leave

696
00:28:42,629 --> 00:28:39,759
this half-hour documentary show on this

697
00:28:44,999 --> 00:28:42,639
journey and Paul was busy and but

698
00:28:47,310 --> 00:28:45,009
suggested Matt and so I got a hold him

699
00:28:50,129 --> 00:28:47,320
back and very quickly we hand it off and

700
00:28:51,749 --> 00:28:50,139
we did the research upfront and he was

701
00:28:53,099 --> 00:28:51,759
approved by the network in a couple of

702
00:28:55,460 --> 00:28:53,109
months we find ourselves there you know

703
00:28:59,700 --> 00:28:55,470
down in Arizona and California and

704
00:29:02,430 --> 00:28:59,710
Wyoming shooting this episode is now the

705
00:29:04,979 --> 00:29:02,440
truth is I wasn't busy you didn't offer

706
00:29:08,849 --> 00:29:04,989
me enough money but I knew that Mac

707
00:29:11,759 --> 00:29:08,859
would work for now so yeah I'm a trooper

708
00:29:15,129 --> 00:29:11,769
don't yeah an espresso or whatever

709
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:15,139
yeah Mac and I had both had love of

710
00:29:18,669 --> 00:29:16,850
espresso so wherever we went we would

711
00:29:20,889 --> 00:29:18,679
find in this first place and disappear

712
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:20,899
and I had like cigarette and espressos

713
00:29:25,149 --> 00:29:22,850
and these especially to just talk about

714
00:29:27,460 --> 00:29:25,159
whatever and so I got lots of little

715
00:29:29,289 --> 00:29:27,470
Mackey's engine which is very great I'm

716
00:29:30,340 --> 00:29:29,299
assuming that most people were a lot of

717
00:29:32,139 --> 00:29:30,350
people that are listening to the show

718
00:29:33,970 --> 00:29:32,149
probably know of Mac or they know

719
00:29:35,980 --> 00:29:33,980
somebody should set them up well you

720
00:29:38,499 --> 00:29:35,990
know why of course we've had several

721
00:29:41,019 --> 00:29:38,509
shows about Mac Mac was on the show and

722
00:29:44,220 --> 00:29:41,029
after he died we had Paul and Greg

723
00:29:46,869 --> 00:29:44,230
Bishop and Nick Redfern on board to do

724
00:29:50,919 --> 00:29:46,879
remembrance a celebration of Mac's life

725
00:29:53,759 --> 00:29:50,929
yeah when you guys were traveling around

726
00:29:58,200 --> 00:29:53,769
one of the people that you ran into in

727
00:30:01,480 --> 00:29:58,210
Wyoming was dr. Leo sprinkle right yes

728
00:30:03,759 --> 00:30:01,490
tell us a bit about how you ran into dr.

729
00:30:10,810 --> 00:30:03,769
sprinkle and and how Mac you know

730
00:30:13,060 --> 00:30:10,820
interacted with them we were we were

731
00:30:15,039 --> 00:30:13,070
filming around Wyoming we were going up

732
00:30:16,509 --> 00:30:15,049
to the infrared telescope and filming

733
00:30:19,810 --> 00:30:16,519
the sequence there with the astronomers

734
00:30:22,210 --> 00:30:19,820
and during a break period Mac was of

735
00:30:24,460 --> 00:30:22,220
course blogging and clearing and all

736
00:30:26,970 --> 00:30:24,470
that stuff and had gotten and Leo had

737
00:30:29,830 --> 00:30:26,980
gotten ahold of him at some holiday and

738
00:30:32,769 --> 00:30:29,840
the same town and so very quickly we

739
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:32,779
added it to the schedule and do much

740
00:30:36,430 --> 00:30:34,730
with Leo we we did an interview we

741
00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:36,440
showed up at this place and Mac

742
00:30:41,369 --> 00:30:38,450
community with him but that was great

743
00:30:44,139 --> 00:30:41,379
that was a great example of holiday its

744
00:30:46,990 --> 00:30:44,149
internet 2.0 it really makes know baking

745
00:30:49,029 --> 00:30:47,000
a lot more yeah what did you talk to

746
00:30:51,450 --> 00:30:49,039
sprinkle about specifically or what did

747
00:30:53,649 --> 00:30:51,460
Mac talk to sprinkle about you know

748
00:30:55,060 --> 00:30:53,659
there was some tension in the episode

749
00:30:55,899 --> 00:30:55,070
because we were trying to deal with some

750
00:30:57,909 --> 00:30:55,909
people from the Jet Propulsion

751
00:30:59,889 --> 00:30:57,919
Laboratory we're dealing with people

752
00:31:01,570 --> 00:30:59,899
from the city and they were concerned

753
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:01,580
that we were going to discuss the

754
00:31:06,759 --> 00:31:04,610
paranormal asketh aspect of UFOs or the

755
00:31:08,049 --> 00:31:06,769
supernatural aspect of UFOs probably

756
00:31:11,649 --> 00:31:08,059
more than that they were comfortable

757
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:11,659
with to be associated with and so Leo

758
00:31:18,100 --> 00:31:13,730
was just a great fine because of course

759
00:31:20,230 --> 00:31:18,110
Leo as personal experiences and has very

760
00:31:22,780 --> 00:31:20,240
strong opinions about the UFO phenomena

761
00:31:25,510 --> 00:31:22,790
so worked out really great and

762
00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:25,520
provided in that episode you know a

763
00:31:29,470 --> 00:31:27,770
discussion that you know would have been

764
00:31:30,460 --> 00:31:29,480
difficult to get to otherwise because it

765
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:30,470
means when you're doing a documentary

766
00:31:34,900 --> 00:31:33,050
like this you can just blab and talk and

767
00:31:36,670 --> 00:31:34,910
profit eyes on the screen you know or

768
00:31:38,380 --> 00:31:36,680
you can get involved with people and get

769
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:38,390
their opinions and listen to them and we

770
00:31:41,830 --> 00:31:40,370
were kind of heavy on the science and

771
00:31:44,530 --> 00:31:41,840
and we wanted to have something on the

772
00:31:46,870 --> 00:31:44,540
on the UF o-- / paranormal weirdness and

773
00:31:50,620 --> 00:31:46,880
night I mean that in them in the nicest

774
00:31:52,660 --> 00:31:50,630
way but so real was sort of just because

775
00:31:55,420 --> 00:31:52,670
of the internet and because of max

776
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:55,430
blogging and online presence you know it

777
00:31:58,870 --> 00:31:57,410
worked out just perfectly first I mean

778
00:32:01,780 --> 00:31:58,880
you know here we are in Laramie Wyoming

779
00:32:04,150 --> 00:32:01,790
and an interview pops up out of nowhere

780
00:32:07,060 --> 00:32:04,160
was awesome with Leo sprinkle of all

781
00:32:09,370 --> 00:32:07,070
people yeah what was max final

782
00:32:10,990 --> 00:32:09,380
conclusions he talked to Seth Shostak

783
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:11,000
didn't mean wasn't he one of the guys on

784
00:32:15,100 --> 00:32:12,890
your list your hit list of people to

785
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:15,110
chat with there's some 42 on the cutting

786
00:32:19,780 --> 00:32:17,570
room floor of Mack and Seth when things

787
00:32:22,060 --> 00:32:19,790
started getting heated up they had those

788
00:32:24,900 --> 00:32:22,070
two inspired you know in his you know on

789
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:24,910
the internet before I was yeah and

790
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:27,650
honestly I hadn't loved the stuff and

791
00:32:33,010 --> 00:32:29,570
Mac had some pretty strong opinions and

792
00:32:34,570 --> 00:32:33,020
of course sort of said so there were

793
00:32:36,990 --> 00:32:34,580
stuff that was said that never made it

794
00:32:39,700 --> 00:32:37,000
through the show but basically you know

795
00:32:41,770 --> 00:32:39,710
in the show we just got said his point

796
00:32:44,620 --> 00:32:41,780
of view and there wasn't there wasn't a

797
00:32:46,540 --> 00:32:44,630
heck of a lot of commentary going on it

798
00:32:49,300 --> 00:32:46,550
could have gone another way but you know

799
00:32:51,130 --> 00:32:49,310
we were doing three episodes if we were

800
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:51,140
spending a year doing a documentary on

801
00:32:54,430 --> 00:32:52,610
this subject you would have been totally

802
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:54,440
different oh yeah we would have

803
00:32:58,870 --> 00:32:56,330
definitely made people uncomfortable you

804
00:33:01,090 --> 00:32:58,880
know God down Rose that probably you

805
00:33:02,500 --> 00:33:01,100
know Robottom by some people but you

806
00:33:04,450 --> 00:33:02,510
know they get kind of roped into it cuz

807
00:33:07,050 --> 00:33:04,460
they're on camera but because of the

808
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:07,060
nature of the series that we were doing

809
00:33:11,950 --> 00:33:09,650
but we don't so let's go down that road

810
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:11,960
briefly yeah

811
00:33:17,710 --> 00:33:15,170
we're not so briefly what did Matt yeah

812
00:33:20,500 --> 00:33:17,720
I can imagine because I'm well aware I

813
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:20,510
talked Mac at length about SETI and

814
00:33:26,290 --> 00:33:23,330
Shostak in particular and he had a he

815
00:33:28,930 --> 00:33:26,300
had a very sort of heavy disdain for dr.

816
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:28,940
Shostak while at the same time he would

817
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:30,170
say look he's obviously an intelligent

818
00:33:34,690 --> 00:33:32,690
man and he's certainly well-spoken and

819
00:33:37,659 --> 00:33:34,700
he's wonderful on television

820
00:33:39,750 --> 00:33:37,669
but that's it and then it was a basic

821
00:33:42,310 --> 00:33:39,760
opinion about it was it comes down to

822
00:33:44,649 --> 00:33:42,320
you know are you doing science because

823
00:33:45,820 --> 00:33:44,659
you want to do exploration you didn't

824
00:33:47,230 --> 00:33:45,830
want to push the boundaries or are you

825
00:33:51,730 --> 00:33:47,240
doing science so that you can pay for

826
00:33:54,010 --> 00:33:51,740
your Beamer and then she can keep high I

827
00:33:55,529 --> 00:33:54,020
mean it can really to be and honestly I

828
00:33:57,279 --> 00:33:55,539
tried to stay out of it because I was

829
00:33:59,110 --> 00:33:57,289
writing and working light another

830
00:34:03,630 --> 00:33:59,120
episode in the series and I was just

831
00:34:11,740 --> 00:34:06,310
did he actually say that to show sack

832
00:34:16,540 --> 00:34:11,750
that you know that's you know the sort

833
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:16,550
of gloves off argument that happens I

834
00:34:21,250 --> 00:34:19,010
think people when when he passed away

835
00:34:23,230 --> 00:34:21,260
they had this impression and people's

836
00:34:25,720 --> 00:34:23,240
opinions of people changed after they

837
00:34:28,450 --> 00:34:25,730
died that Mack Bailey was he was a

838
00:34:31,359 --> 00:34:28,460
genuinely nice person but that he was so

839
00:34:33,339 --> 00:34:31,369
nice that he would just kind of he was

840
00:34:37,659 --> 00:34:33,349
agreeable and the truth is he was a very

841
00:34:40,060 --> 00:34:37,669
disagreeable person just that Mac would

842
00:34:42,369 --> 00:34:40,070
would always defer to the louder person

843
00:34:44,470 --> 00:34:42,379
in a conversation and occasionally Mac

844
00:34:47,290 --> 00:34:44,480
would get his ire up and speak a word

845
00:34:49,450 --> 00:34:47,300
but you know in the sort of higher a

846
00:34:51,250 --> 00:34:49,460
conversation sometimes Mac Mike Mac is a

847
00:34:54,190 --> 00:34:51,260
humble guy and you know it's interesting

848
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:54,200
is and even though Mac and Seth did sort

849
00:34:58,720 --> 00:34:56,450
of like have a face on face for it was

850
00:35:01,870 --> 00:34:58,730
it wasn't all that heavy weight I mean

851
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:01,880
the producer Jen Jennifer at the time

852
00:35:06,310 --> 00:35:04,490
thought it was potentially gonna go get

853
00:35:08,050 --> 00:35:06,320
a little bit too kinda heavy duty but

854
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:08,060
there was a good amount of respect

855
00:35:11,950 --> 00:35:10,010
between the thing guys like that's

856
00:35:14,170 --> 00:35:11,960
everything book back and actually is it

857
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:14,180
should be in my opinion cassette food

858
00:35:20,370 --> 00:35:16,970
they respected each other and that

859
00:35:23,410 --> 00:35:20,380
actually showed them around quite a bit

860
00:35:25,300 --> 00:35:23,420
yeah well you know if Seth Shostak and

861
00:35:26,710 --> 00:35:25,310
Stan Friedman could do a cruise across

862
00:35:29,410 --> 00:35:26,720
the Atlantic and have a series of

863
00:35:30,849 --> 00:35:29,420
debates about SETI and UFOs I think Seth

864
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:30,859
can get along with anyone he's always

865
00:35:34,540 --> 00:35:32,810
seemed to be you know pretty agreeable

866
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:34,550
and opinionated and I guess that's what

867
00:35:39,820 --> 00:35:37,570
Mac was too agreeable and opinionated

868
00:35:43,300 --> 00:35:39,830
should I ask about some of these house

869
00:35:44,890 --> 00:35:43,310
critics are they really critical of this

870
00:35:47,170 --> 00:35:44,900
stuff or they just

871
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:47,180
doing a show well yeah there's a certain

872
00:35:50,230 --> 00:35:48,770
show business aspect to it I mean you

873
00:35:52,599 --> 00:35:50,240
know there's people coming and going at

874
00:35:54,279 --> 00:35:52,609
the city all the time there's people who

875
00:35:55,720 --> 00:35:54,289
actually put put their money into it

876
00:35:58,900 --> 00:35:55,730
they come in you know have a look around

877
00:36:00,220 --> 00:35:58,910
and and but you know by their own

878
00:36:02,289 --> 00:36:00,230
admission said he knows that they're

879
00:36:04,599 --> 00:36:02,299
only looking at an extremely tiny slice

880
00:36:09,220 --> 00:36:04,609
of the spectrum let alone you know the

881
00:36:10,930 --> 00:36:09,230
physical locations and you know I don't

882
00:36:13,420 --> 00:36:10,940
really personally get the impression

883
00:36:15,670 --> 00:36:13,430
that they were trying to put across that

884
00:36:17,980 --> 00:36:15,680
you know they were reveal and end all of

885
00:36:20,319 --> 00:36:17,990
this immediately finding out was like

886
00:36:22,779 --> 00:36:20,329
fun other planets but there's a certain

887
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:22,789
sort of you know justification in their

888
00:36:27,370 --> 00:36:25,490
minds to what they were doing that would

889
00:36:28,569 --> 00:36:27,380
it be non sequitur to people who are

890
00:36:31,630 --> 00:36:28,579
thinking of outside of the box

891
00:36:33,370 --> 00:36:31,640
approaches to alien contact but the

892
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:33,380
thing I also bothered to me here is that

893
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:35,450
if they actually get the signal

894
00:36:39,130 --> 00:36:36,770
you know because you think of a scene an

895
00:36:41,230 --> 00:36:39,140
independent state we get the signal from

896
00:36:43,059 --> 00:36:41,240
outer space they're out of business

897
00:36:47,470 --> 00:36:43,069
because then other scientific

898
00:36:49,240 --> 00:36:47,480
disciplines take over because I think

899
00:36:51,579 --> 00:36:49,250
that if anything it would be a boon to

900
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:51,589
their business because first of all they

901
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:53,450
would actually have hard data they could

902
00:36:58,599 --> 00:36:56,450
actually focus their research rather

903
00:37:02,049 --> 00:36:58,609
than the random and sort of calculating

904
00:37:03,309 --> 00:37:02,059
way and I think I actually added well

905
00:37:05,950 --> 00:37:03,319
see do any good they're in a more

906
00:37:07,839 --> 00:37:05,960
tenuous position right now and they it's

907
00:37:09,849 --> 00:37:07,849
not that they make contact plenty of

908
00:37:12,010 --> 00:37:09,859
bursts of information or things that

909
00:37:13,809 --> 00:37:12,020
look like information and all kinds of

910
00:37:17,019 --> 00:37:13,819
events that we don't hear about that

911
00:37:19,539 --> 00:37:17,029
they met and then discard or save for

912
00:37:22,690 --> 00:37:19,549
later and we mean like we may have

913
00:37:25,210 --> 00:37:22,700
actually picked out something years ago

914
00:37:27,609 --> 00:37:25,220
yeah I know what jeans saying though and

915
00:37:29,109 --> 00:37:27,619
I think it's I think his point is valid

916
00:37:31,210 --> 00:37:29,119
in the sense that if you actually made

917
00:37:34,299 --> 00:37:31,220
contact with an alien civilization

918
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:34,309
they're good scientists at SETI but all

919
00:37:37,210 --> 00:37:35,690
of a sudden there's an awful lot of good

920
00:37:39,069 --> 00:37:37,220
scientists on this planet that are

921
00:37:40,930 --> 00:37:39,079
working in a lot of other things that

922
00:37:44,049 --> 00:37:40,940
would become very very interested in

923
00:37:45,609 --> 00:37:44,059
that very quickly who might not be

924
00:37:49,359 --> 00:37:45,619
interested in it right now because it

925
00:37:52,390 --> 00:37:49,369
obviously that's like like the geologist

926
00:37:54,519 --> 00:37:52,400
and you know the paleontologists and and

927
00:37:57,190 --> 00:37:54,529
all of these ologists will be in there

928
00:37:58,299 --> 00:37:57,200
like like you know flies on bed rest

929
00:37:59,679 --> 00:37:58,309
pretty sure

930
00:38:02,229 --> 00:37:59,689
the only ones who wouldn't be invited

931
00:38:03,579 --> 00:38:02,239
would be ufologists never invited to

932
00:38:05,739 --> 00:38:03,589
anything I'll tell you that's the

933
00:38:09,459 --> 00:38:05,749
problem here nobody will ever take us

934
00:38:11,499 --> 00:38:09,469
seriously yeah well we take our they

935
00:38:13,449 --> 00:38:11,509
take themselves so seriously that I I

936
00:38:14,499 --> 00:38:13,459
think they've got the taking seriously

937
00:38:17,109 --> 00:38:14,509
part of it covered

938
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:17,119
so it's interesting though a little ears

939
00:38:21,789 --> 00:38:19,130
a little Mac tidbit for you and Sethi

940
00:38:24,189 --> 00:38:21,799
when we were co-writing the the feature

941
00:38:26,140 --> 00:38:24,199
film I'm doing later this year doing

942
00:38:27,939 --> 00:38:26,150
time the sci-fi film there was a

943
00:38:29,799 --> 00:38:27,949
villainous character that was required

944
00:38:32,049 --> 00:38:29,809
and Mac and I had long conversations

945
00:38:35,370 --> 00:38:32,059
about this and we finally turned him

946
00:38:38,049 --> 00:38:35,380
into basically Seth Shostak so there's

947
00:38:39,429 --> 00:38:38,059
there's a character shows up from what

948
00:38:43,839 --> 00:38:39,439
do we call the signed the space

949
00:38:45,549 --> 00:38:43,849
exploration foundation Seth and the guy

950
00:38:46,269 --> 00:38:45,559
who shows up is this sort of fiftyish

951
00:38:48,609 --> 00:38:46,279
scientist

952
00:38:50,650 --> 00:38:48,619
and he seems very nice and friendly but

953
00:38:51,939 --> 00:38:50,660
it turns out he's the bad guy not and I

954
00:38:54,339 --> 00:38:51,949
don't want to ruin the film but there it

955
00:38:57,429 --> 00:38:54,349
is and Mac Mac and I had an awful lot of

956
00:38:59,199 --> 00:38:57,439
good chuckles about that and we sort of

957
00:39:00,789 --> 00:38:59,209
thought are we gonna get sued and then

958
00:39:02,620 --> 00:39:00,799
we said nah nobody'll know and

959
00:39:04,929 --> 00:39:02,630
unfortunately now they're gonna know so

960
00:39:06,459 --> 00:39:04,939
if he knows maybe he liked the idea you

961
00:39:10,029 --> 00:39:06,469
know his ego would be kind of filled

962
00:39:11,620 --> 00:39:10,039
with the knowledge that his villain

963
00:39:13,479 --> 00:39:11,630
well he's kind of like a Darth Vader he

964
00:39:15,309 --> 00:39:13,489
sort of turns you know maybe he turns

965
00:39:18,069 --> 00:39:15,319
good in the end I don't know yeah it's

966
00:39:20,259 --> 00:39:18,079
the cultural impact though of Seti very

967
00:39:22,509 --> 00:39:20,269
little money relatively speaking goes

968
00:39:25,059 --> 00:39:22,519
into SETI I mean compared to other

969
00:39:26,949 --> 00:39:25,069
expenses on developing bombers and stuff

970
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:26,959
and you know they're searching for a

971
00:39:29,769 --> 00:39:28,729
needle in a haystack and they don't even

972
00:39:32,049 --> 00:39:29,779
know if the needles in the haystack

973
00:39:35,019 --> 00:39:32,059
although they think it is and yet

974
00:39:37,029 --> 00:39:35,029
they've Perfetti has permeated I think

975
00:39:39,069 --> 00:39:37,039
American culture certainly and probably

976
00:39:40,509 --> 00:39:39,079
most of Western culture so that I think

977
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:40,519
if you ask most people they might at

978
00:39:45,699 --> 00:39:42,890
least have heard of it or seen it and if

979
00:39:49,989 --> 00:39:45,709
nothing else SETI is a tremendous public

980
00:39:51,699 --> 00:39:49,999
relations bonanza triumph for them that

981
00:39:54,339 --> 00:39:51,709
ufology has just never been able to

982
00:39:56,289 --> 00:39:54,349
muster and I've always wondered why and

983
00:39:58,569 --> 00:39:56,299
I think part of it is because the SETI

984
00:40:01,419 --> 00:39:58,579
guys are just so disciplined they stay

985
00:40:02,949 --> 00:40:01,429
on message consistently they sound

986
00:40:05,349 --> 00:40:02,959
intelligent and articulate and they

987
00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:05,359
generally speaking only put the best

988
00:40:10,179 --> 00:40:08,089
most well spoken of their members out

989
00:40:11,420 --> 00:40:10,189
front to the media whereas ufology is

990
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:11,430
like herding cats

991
00:40:15,500 --> 00:40:13,410
so every now and then you'll get a smart

992
00:40:17,329 --> 00:40:15,510
guy like Jerry Clark or Stan Friedman

993
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:17,339
who even if you disagree they sound

994
00:40:22,819 --> 00:40:19,770
smart but then you know 18 other cats

995
00:40:23,809 --> 00:40:22,829
come in and ruin it for everybody it's

996
00:40:25,940 --> 00:40:23,819
always struck me the difference between

997
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:25,950
SETI and ufology they're not that

998
00:40:31,309 --> 00:40:28,170
different in terms of a what they're

999
00:40:32,690 --> 00:40:31,319
looking for and B I would argue sort of

1000
00:40:34,730 --> 00:40:32,700
the scientific merit of how they're

1001
00:40:36,859 --> 00:40:34,740
going about doing it and yet one of them

1002
00:40:38,990 --> 00:40:36,869
gets millions of dollars and scientific

1003
00:40:41,569 --> 00:40:39,000
respect and another one even though it

1004
00:40:42,230 --> 00:40:41,579
has scientists attached to it gets no

1005
00:40:44,029 --> 00:40:42,240
respect

1006
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:44,039
and I've always wondered about that I

1007
00:40:49,190 --> 00:40:45,930
sometimes think it's more ufology fault

1008
00:40:51,170 --> 00:40:49,200
than anybody else's perhaps some

1009
00:40:53,299 --> 00:40:51,180
sponsors of SETI Ames Research Center

1010
00:40:55,250 --> 00:40:53,309
NASA headquarters National Science

1011
00:40:57,380 --> 00:40:55,260
Foundation for a bit of energy the US

1012
00:41:00,470 --> 00:40:57,390
Geological Survey propulsion laboratory

1013
00:41:02,839 --> 00:41:00,480
center etc etc etc he looked over the

1014
00:41:04,849 --> 00:41:02,849
packet morning there was Mary Hewitt so

1015
00:41:07,069 --> 00:41:04,859
these individuals in this tenders

1016
00:41:08,990 --> 00:41:07,079
there's Institute's they get funding

1017
00:41:11,029 --> 00:41:09,000
from a lot of different sources and I

1018
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:11,039
mean they are in the in a way they're

1019
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:11,970
sort of like that

1020
00:41:15,380 --> 00:41:14,130
sort of like a professional machine I

1021
00:41:17,779 --> 00:41:15,390
mean as long as they don't find anything

1022
00:41:19,279 --> 00:41:17,789
we can keep on going and when they do

1023
00:41:21,260 --> 00:41:19,289
you find something things will

1024
00:41:22,730 --> 00:41:21,270
fundamentally change if they do find

1025
00:41:23,900 --> 00:41:22,740
something they probably would have

1026
00:41:26,299 --> 00:41:23,910
already if they were going to find

1027
00:41:27,859 --> 00:41:26,309
something like anybody well it comes

1028
00:41:30,349 --> 00:41:27,869
back to the same issue again if they

1029
00:41:32,150 --> 00:41:30,359
found something would that mean that

1030
00:41:35,539 --> 00:41:32,160
they would have further research to do

1031
00:41:37,849 --> 00:41:35,549
or does that put the closing sign on the

1032
00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:37,859
door saying eventually you shut down and

1033
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:39,450
now we prepare for the next stage

1034
00:41:49,469 --> 00:41:46,370
[Music]

1035
00:41:51,569 --> 00:41:49,479
fake magazine provides true reports of

1036
00:41:54,150 --> 00:41:51,579
the strange and unknown keep up with the

1037
00:41:57,299 --> 00:41:54,160
latest on angels and miracles psychic

1038
00:41:58,410 --> 00:41:57,309
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1039
00:42:00,660 --> 00:41:58,420
and much much more

1040
00:42:03,299 --> 00:42:00,670
to receive your free issue of faith

1041
00:42:07,229 --> 00:42:03,309
magazine call now at one eight hundred

1042
00:42:10,829 --> 00:42:07,239
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1043
00:42:13,739 --> 00:42:10,839
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1044
00:42:20,660 --> 00:42:13,749
calm that's one eight hundred seven two

1045
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:20,670
eight twenty seven thirty or WWF a TEM

1046
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:24,880
AG calm what are you waiting for your

1047
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:28,010
fate awaits

1048
00:42:41,739 --> 00:42:39,789
I'll tell you what the next stage of

1049
00:42:44,410 --> 00:42:41,749
this show with our special guest host

1050
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:44,420
Paul Kimble it's with filmmaker Michael

1051
00:42:49,269 --> 00:42:47,210
McDonald who does documentary films he's

1052
00:42:51,309 --> 00:42:49,279
covered UFOs in the power and Rommel in

1053
00:42:53,349 --> 00:42:51,319
going into making these films Michael

1054
00:42:54,849 --> 00:42:53,359
what is your viewpoint about all these

1055
00:42:56,259 --> 00:42:54,859
subjects I mean when you make a film you

1056
00:42:58,329 --> 00:42:56,269
don't have to believe in the subject

1057
00:43:00,069 --> 00:42:58,339
matter you just want to make a good film

1058
00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:00,079
to make a living or for artistic

1059
00:43:09,249 --> 00:43:02,450
purposes or both what is your real

1060
00:43:11,709 --> 00:43:09,259
feeling because they were startups else

1061
00:43:12,999 --> 00:43:11,719
narrative projects ideas that I came up

1062
00:43:16,569 --> 00:43:13,009
with other things that I was interested

1063
00:43:18,849 --> 00:43:16,579
in so I am my history of UFOs goes back

1064
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:18,859
to as far as I can remember as a matter

1065
00:43:23,709 --> 00:43:20,690
of fact there's even an episode of my

1066
00:43:25,779 --> 00:43:23,719
life a dream that I had that you know

1067
00:43:29,979 --> 00:43:25,789
when I was just a small child

1068
00:43:33,809 --> 00:43:29,989
that's featured in Maxim is broken

1069
00:43:36,099 --> 00:43:33,819
stories crypto terrestrials yes right

1070
00:43:38,079 --> 00:43:36,109
you know tell us about the incident

1071
00:43:39,670 --> 00:43:38,089
because we are going to discuss the book

1072
00:43:42,759 --> 00:43:39,680
on a future episode of the parent cast

1073
00:43:46,150 --> 00:43:42,769
well it's a dream my head that I always

1074
00:43:48,069 --> 00:43:46,160
remember and the dream I'm standing in a

1075
00:43:50,019 --> 00:43:48,079
cave I'm very young like we're talking

1076
00:43:52,989 --> 00:43:50,029
four or five years old standing in a

1077
00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:52,999
cave with my father and my father is

1078
00:43:58,029 --> 00:43:55,130
extremely upset I'm sad when

1079
00:44:00,670 --> 00:43:58,039
unsettlingly upset today I look over I

1080
00:44:04,709 --> 00:44:00,680
glanced over to my left and they're

1081
00:44:08,709 --> 00:44:04,719
sitting on a I guess a rock thrown is a

1082
00:44:09,940 --> 00:44:08,719
large pansy flower like the kinds of

1083
00:44:11,609 --> 00:44:09,950
pansies that when you look at them they

1084
00:44:14,229 --> 00:44:11,619
look like they have the guys and

1085
00:44:17,410 --> 00:44:14,239
emanating from this creature this being

1086
00:44:19,299 --> 00:44:17,420
is disdain you know to the nth power

1087
00:44:22,499 --> 00:44:19,309
that's sort of the basic sort of

1088
00:44:25,180 --> 00:44:22,509
emotional its disdain and its areas and

1089
00:44:28,359 --> 00:44:25,190
it's not friendly but it's not

1090
00:44:30,999 --> 00:44:28,369
necessarily an imminent physical threat

1091
00:44:32,799 --> 00:44:31,009
and that's all it is it's a dream that

1092
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:32,809
stuck with me but the striking thing

1093
00:44:37,599 --> 00:44:34,729
about it is that it's early early early

1094
00:44:40,630 --> 00:44:37,609
like that stuck with me you know and

1095
00:44:42,819 --> 00:44:40,640
remember you know possibly you know it's

1096
00:44:44,829 --> 00:44:42,829
very bare minimum yearly in my life is

1097
00:44:47,739 --> 00:44:44,839
got more somehow I ended up in that book

1098
00:44:49,359 --> 00:44:47,749
you don't know what the context of how

1099
00:44:50,720 --> 00:44:49,369
we use I haven't read his book yet it's

1100
00:44:54,770 --> 00:44:50,730
on its way to me you don't know what

1101
00:44:56,210 --> 00:44:54,780
I know it's a bike well and contacted me

1102
00:45:00,520 --> 00:44:56,220
cos Mike and I have met through a blog

1103
00:45:02,870 --> 00:45:00,530
and Mike's thing is synchronicity and

1104
00:45:07,550 --> 00:45:02,880
wonderful vlogs he has a really

1105
00:45:10,069 --> 00:45:07,560
interesting thinking guy you could say

1106
00:45:13,010 --> 00:45:10,079
thirteen is an illustrator public good

1107
00:45:15,950 --> 00:45:13,020
of everything I had mentioned that dream

1108
00:45:18,109 --> 00:45:15,960
in one of my blog entries on on the

1109
00:45:20,329 --> 00:45:18,119
paranormal and I think he picked up on

1110
00:45:22,670 --> 00:45:20,339
that and then just sort of decided and

1111
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:22,680
and that can make comment about the good

1112
00:45:26,900 --> 00:45:24,570
blog and I think the two have been made

1113
00:45:28,550 --> 00:45:26,910
it together really well by the way Mike

1114
00:45:30,819 --> 00:45:28,560
did the illustrations for the book

1115
00:45:32,900 --> 00:45:30,829
that's written really really fascinating

1116
00:45:34,310 --> 00:45:32,910
illustrations and Mike has also been on

1117
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:34,320
her show a couple of times because he's

1118
00:45:39,230 --> 00:45:36,810
had some of these weird synchronicity

1119
00:45:41,329 --> 00:45:39,240
type experiences over his lifetime

1120
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:41,339
in any case Michael you never had

1121
00:45:50,390 --> 00:45:44,490
another dream or weird thing happened to

1122
00:45:54,020 --> 00:45:50,400
you then okay let's sear this you know

1123
00:45:55,970 --> 00:45:54,030
nothing in particular that alone that

1124
00:45:57,920 --> 00:45:55,980
you can take but if you look at over the

1125
00:46:00,819 --> 00:45:57,930
lifetime experience it just sort of adds

1126
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:00,829
up like why was i interested in UFOs and

1127
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:03,210
aliens for so long in my life

1128
00:46:10,700 --> 00:46:05,490
sure I grew up with Star Trek was in its

1129
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:10,710
first run okay watch it and legs are on

1130
00:46:18,230 --> 00:46:13,170
and and all of those TV shows and the

1131
00:46:20,690 --> 00:46:18,240
media and names were friendly so I

1132
00:46:22,609 --> 00:46:20,700
haven't exposed to that all my life but

1133
00:46:24,740 --> 00:46:22,619
a multi had like sort of experiences

1134
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:24,750
over my life that I don't necessarily

1135
00:46:29,030 --> 00:46:26,970
quite directly feel like I wouldn't go

1136
00:46:30,620 --> 00:46:29,040
up to Dave David say hey Dave you took

1137
00:46:34,220 --> 00:46:30,630
me out that might have passed away I

1138
00:46:37,370 --> 00:46:34,230
don't think I go that far but you know I

1139
00:46:39,710 --> 00:46:37,380
mean the world is it's not all that you

1140
00:46:42,380 --> 00:46:39,720
see and touch and people have

1141
00:46:44,930 --> 00:46:42,390
connections with each other that are you

1142
00:46:47,780 --> 00:46:44,940
know considered to be a psycho or a

1143
00:46:49,990 --> 00:46:47,790
paranormal nature there's ghost advance

1144
00:46:51,980 --> 00:46:50,000
if you evolve into the only events

1145
00:46:55,130 --> 00:46:51,990
Mothman there's there's

1146
00:46:57,329 --> 00:46:55,140
popular culture into something and the

1147
00:47:00,650 --> 00:46:57,339
the subconscious the collective

1148
00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:00,660
subconscious so I think that

1149
00:47:07,499 --> 00:47:03,729
synchronicities is my calling I think

1150
00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:07,509
really quite quite succinctly sums it up

1151
00:47:11,009 --> 00:47:08,890
is that it really does come down to

1152
00:47:13,979 --> 00:47:11,019
synchronicity that's why I love its

1153
00:47:16,289 --> 00:47:13,989
blogs too much and you notice how the

1154
00:47:18,599 --> 00:47:16,299
subjects in his blog are quite wide and

1155
00:47:20,759 --> 00:47:18,609
varied but all following fall under that

1156
00:47:25,349 --> 00:47:20,769
sort of synchronistic sort of aspect so

1157
00:47:27,569 --> 00:47:25,359
I definitely I'm actually gotten quite

1158
00:47:30,089 --> 00:47:27,579
sick of talking about UFOs in the aliens

1159
00:47:32,039 --> 00:47:30,099
and I and I joke about it because I

1160
00:47:34,620 --> 00:47:32,049
guess I come to the conclusion is that

1161
00:47:36,209 --> 00:47:34,630
you know it's all well and good but I've

1162
00:47:42,599 --> 00:47:36,219
been reading everybody's opinion for the

1163
00:47:45,150 --> 00:47:42,609
last 25 years everybody and everybody's

1164
00:47:47,909 --> 00:47:45,160
got you know a point or two and strong

1165
00:47:49,559 --> 00:47:47,919
convictions and like geez II know I

1166
00:47:52,919 --> 00:47:49,569
don't think in my lifetime I'm ever

1167
00:47:55,019 --> 00:47:52,929
gonna know and so that's sort of initial

1168
00:47:56,870 --> 00:47:55,029
so I think you can find out I think they

1169
00:48:00,929 --> 00:47:56,880
can find out it's sort of faded away

1170
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:00,939
cynicism I hate to say it you know what

1171
00:48:04,949 --> 00:48:03,130
that's like a lot of people are awful

1172
00:48:07,140 --> 00:48:04,959
number of people awful large number of

1173
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:07,150
people Michael have exactly the same

1174
00:48:10,799 --> 00:48:09,130
opinion they get involved in this very

1175
00:48:12,870 --> 00:48:10,809
enthusiastic Wow

1176
00:48:16,439 --> 00:48:12,880
it's the aliens we're going to discover

1177
00:48:19,709 --> 00:48:16,449
et or whatever it is and then it just

1178
00:48:22,439 --> 00:48:19,719
gets dragged into the mud and I know

1179
00:48:25,199 --> 00:48:22,449
that our listeners have heard the story

1180
00:48:27,929 --> 00:48:25,209
before I got involved with UFOs early on

1181
00:48:30,209 --> 00:48:27,939
I got out of it I felt it was toxic I

1182
00:48:32,939 --> 00:48:30,219
got back into it again and Here I am

1183
00:48:35,069 --> 00:48:32,949
again and I finally realized as I get

1184
00:48:37,229 --> 00:48:35,079
older that might as well just go with

1185
00:48:40,649 --> 00:48:37,239
the flow see where it takes us and maybe

1186
00:48:42,919 --> 00:48:40,659
the discovery is its own reward now yeah

1187
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:42,929
exactly and the other thing too is that

1188
00:48:47,279 --> 00:48:45,249
and this happens a lot is that there's

1189
00:48:48,870 --> 00:48:47,289
discussions between people there's all

1190
00:48:50,519 --> 00:48:48,880
kind of you know it's just normal human

1191
00:48:51,599 --> 00:48:50,529
interaction kind of stuff that happens

1192
00:48:53,130 --> 00:48:51,609
and people decide they don't like

1193
00:48:54,899 --> 00:48:53,140
something that somebody said they don't

1194
00:48:56,819 --> 00:48:54,909
like but look at somebody or whatever

1195
00:48:59,069 --> 00:48:56,829
and they get into these arguments and

1196
00:49:01,019 --> 00:48:59,079
the great thing but the way I look at it

1197
00:49:02,669 --> 00:49:01,029
from my position is is that I can just

1198
00:49:04,529 --> 00:49:02,679
sort of sit back and try to take from

1199
00:49:06,530 --> 00:49:04,539
these areas what I agree with what I

1200
00:49:09,050 --> 00:49:06,540
don't agree with without gaining

1201
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:09,060
I didn't want to get involved in it and

1202
00:49:13,790 --> 00:49:11,370
I'd believe me I mean I hosted a UFO

1203
00:49:15,830 --> 00:49:13,800
conference here here in Halifax in 2003

1204
00:49:20,150 --> 00:49:15,840
was a successful conference a beef

1205
00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:20,160
Jacobs I had gone later for styles and I

1206
00:49:29,830 --> 00:49:25,730
had and I shouldn't have you fall yeah

1207
00:49:33,370 --> 00:49:29,840
anyhow you know I we were accosted by

1208
00:49:36,740 --> 00:49:33,380
billy meier disciples I mean you know

1209
00:49:37,940 --> 00:49:36,750
hands out in criticizes a purpose I

1210
00:49:38,930 --> 00:49:37,950
thought we got into his apartment he

1211
00:49:40,670 --> 00:49:38,940
went into his apartment to pick

1212
00:49:42,530 --> 00:49:40,680
something up I'm taking them around I'm

1213
00:49:44,690 --> 00:49:42,540
press junkets to impress junk instead of

1214
00:49:46,940 --> 00:49:44,700
takin him around and he opens up his

1215
00:49:48,830 --> 00:49:46,950
apartment and there's two or three older

1216
00:49:50,030 --> 00:49:48,840
people in their 60s sitting in his

1217
00:49:53,240 --> 00:49:50,040
apartment on his couch

1218
00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:53,250
I know wanting an answer or actually

1219
00:49:56,720 --> 00:49:54,930
wanting him to listen to their answer

1220
00:49:59,600 --> 00:49:56,730
probably more the better way today and

1221
00:50:01,250 --> 00:49:59,610
that's it Chris to his credit he's a

1222
00:50:03,140 --> 00:50:01,260
cool cucumber let me tell you this guy's

1223
00:50:04,970 --> 00:50:03,150
been around he says he looks at me says

1224
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:04,980
I don't know who we are I don't know

1225
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:06,930
what you're up to but I just want to

1226
00:50:10,330 --> 00:50:08,130
tell you this I want you out of my

1227
00:50:13,450 --> 00:50:10,340
apartment before I get back I gotta go I

1228
00:50:16,940 --> 00:50:13,460
[Laughter]

1229
00:50:19,790 --> 00:50:16,950
know people like that I was looking at

1230
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:19,800
the list of some of the documentaries

1231
00:50:24,020 --> 00:50:21,570
you've done and this is one which has

1232
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:24,030
gotten really hot and heavy over and our

1233
00:50:29,050 --> 00:50:26,370
forms we have it at the forum got the

1234
00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:29,060
power cast calm and it concerns

1235
00:50:34,850 --> 00:50:33,090
intruders abductees speak out oh yeah

1236
00:50:37,270 --> 00:50:34,860
all right so then of course gets to be

1237
00:50:39,950 --> 00:50:37,280
very controversial because not just

1238
00:50:42,890 --> 00:50:39,960
people being abducted but the

1239
00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:42,900
methodology in researching this so how

1240
00:50:50,780 --> 00:50:46,130
did you approach this subject

1241
00:50:52,820 --> 00:50:50,790
well I decided that in the time and the

1242
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:52,830
money that I had I could interview I

1243
00:50:57,310 --> 00:50:54,570
could get hold of certain people and

1244
00:50:59,990 --> 00:50:57,320
when it came to duck shion's I thought

1245
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:00,000
about Hopkins I thought it'd be Jenkins

1246
00:51:07,070 --> 00:51:03,090
I contacted them they were available I

1247
00:51:09,680 --> 00:51:07,080
actually had David down two before to

1248
00:51:11,870 --> 00:51:09,690
the UFO conference in my head so I knew

1249
00:51:15,590 --> 00:51:11,880
David I thought what he was talking

1250
00:51:18,140 --> 00:51:15,600
about was extremely unsettling and in

1251
00:51:18,769 --> 00:51:18,150
terms of is his research methodology I

1252
00:51:20,839 --> 00:51:18,779
can

1253
00:51:23,449 --> 00:51:20,849
really common too much artists because

1254
00:51:25,370 --> 00:51:23,459
you know I have a Ford Seeley files but

1255
00:51:28,399 --> 00:51:25,380
we didn't actually have in the

1256
00:51:30,589 --> 00:51:28,409
documentary the lady from the US who

1257
00:51:35,959 --> 00:51:30,599
have been treated by Dave Jacobs or

1258
00:51:38,599 --> 00:51:35,969
listen to no I don't aired on American

1259
00:51:46,969 --> 00:51:38,609
TV has it I just wonder whether is that

1260
00:51:48,469 --> 00:51:46,979
there is that other thing or a bad thing

1261
00:51:53,659 --> 00:51:48,479
does it bring more attention to what you

1262
00:51:54,799 --> 00:51:53,669
do or just deprive you of income it does

1263
00:51:57,649 --> 00:51:54,809
both

1264
00:51:59,059 --> 00:51:57,659
you know I translated in the Russian go

1265
00:52:00,349 --> 00:51:59,069
through all like all that job well I'd

1266
00:52:02,209 --> 00:52:00,359
prefer like at least they have the

1267
00:52:05,899 --> 00:52:02,219
credits that I gave myself instead of

1268
00:52:07,339 --> 00:52:05,909
being called away yeah it's it's

1269
00:52:09,319 --> 00:52:07,349
interesting because Mike and I had a

1270
00:52:12,499 --> 00:52:09,329
brief falling out we're all friends now

1271
00:52:15,049 --> 00:52:12,509
again a couple of beer but we're good

1272
00:52:17,599 --> 00:52:15,059
but of all things over alien abductions

1273
00:52:19,519 --> 00:52:17,609
or the abduction phenomenon because as I

1274
00:52:21,769 --> 00:52:19,529
recall Mike you put some posting up on

1275
00:52:24,289 --> 00:52:21,779
your Facebook page and I made some

1276
00:52:26,749 --> 00:52:24,299
remarks about how and people would know

1277
00:52:29,899 --> 00:52:26,759
I have troubles with the methodology and

1278
00:52:31,729 --> 00:52:29,909
and all of that and Facebook is not the

1279
00:52:33,529 --> 00:52:31,739
place to have those debates that's

1280
00:52:35,839 --> 00:52:33,539
that's the one thing I think we can

1281
00:52:44,269 --> 00:52:35,849
agree on but it's a very touchy subject

1282
00:52:46,849 --> 00:52:44,279
even with these like what I don't know

1283
00:52:48,499 --> 00:52:46,859
that's yeah you don't face it's not for

1284
00:52:50,989 --> 00:52:48,509
Facebook I don't know if we want to

1285
00:52:53,539 --> 00:52:50,999
replay the debate but you just peaked my

1286
00:52:55,909 --> 00:52:53,549
interest guys so all right we know that

1287
00:52:58,329 --> 00:52:55,919
oh yeah you're already dancing around

1288
00:53:01,159 --> 00:52:58,339
the bush it's it's all about Dana Jacobs

1289
00:53:03,140 --> 00:53:01,169
methodology and buttons as well okay

1290
00:53:05,479 --> 00:53:03,150
well here's the thing that we kind of

1291
00:53:08,539 --> 00:53:05,489
know where Paul stands on this which is

1292
00:53:10,279 --> 00:53:08,549
well we're going to ask if we need to

1293
00:53:13,249 --> 00:53:10,289
explain to our listeners so what do you

1294
00:53:16,729 --> 00:53:13,259
think here do you think that it makes

1295
00:53:18,469 --> 00:53:16,739
sense at all to try to use hypnotic

1296
00:53:19,609 --> 00:53:18,479
regression to get this information is

1297
00:53:21,380 --> 00:53:19,619
there any hope of getting accurate

1298
00:53:24,469 --> 00:53:21,390
information or is it just feeding the

1299
00:53:26,419 --> 00:53:24,479
fantasy that's a great question that's a

1300
00:53:28,549 --> 00:53:26,429
great question what do you think'll it's

1301
00:53:30,709 --> 00:53:28,559
just feeding the fantasy my problem is

1302
00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:30,719
not with Jacobs personally or Hopkins or

1303
00:53:33,460 --> 00:53:31,130
any of the

1304
00:53:35,530 --> 00:53:33,470
as people and the thing that I've

1305
00:53:37,240 --> 00:53:35,540
noticed on the para caste forum is it's

1306
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:37,250
become in other forms it's become very

1307
00:53:41,890 --> 00:53:39,770
personal there because of this dispute

1308
00:53:44,710 --> 00:53:41,900
that Jacobs is involved in now they're

1309
00:53:46,570 --> 00:53:44,720
attacking him personally and eventually

1310
00:53:48,100 --> 00:53:46,580
I think they'll start attacking all of

1311
00:53:50,260 --> 00:53:48,110
these people personally for me it's not

1312
00:53:53,980 --> 00:53:50,270
personal its professional and I do not

1313
00:53:56,500 --> 00:53:53,990
believe that hypnosis is a valid tool

1314
00:53:58,870 --> 00:53:56,510
for recovering memories there's reason

1315
00:54:00,040 --> 00:53:58,880
why hypnotically induced testimony isn't

1316
00:54:04,210 --> 00:54:00,050
allowed mid court of law for instance

1317
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:04,220
you can go to the Crown Prosecution

1318
00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:06,170
Service website in the United Kingdom

1319
00:54:11,350 --> 00:54:08,330
for instance and take a look at exactly

1320
00:54:12,700 --> 00:54:11,360
how they deal with hypnosis now the

1321
00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:12,710
interesting thing is you can't use

1322
00:54:18,340 --> 00:54:15,290
hypnotically induced testimony in a

1323
00:54:23,160 --> 00:54:18,350
trial but the police will use hypnosis

1324
00:54:26,050 --> 00:54:23,170
as an investigative tool the tool right

1325
00:54:27,070 --> 00:54:26,060
well I was just gonna say how how valid

1326
00:54:28,930 --> 00:54:27,080
is that though because the police

1327
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:28,940
sometimes occasionally will use psychics

1328
00:54:36,070 --> 00:54:33,890
but that points out to me like I would

1329
00:54:38,140 --> 00:54:36,080
not use hypnosis as a tool for

1330
00:54:40,750 --> 00:54:38,150
investigation I think especially in some

1331
00:54:43,030 --> 00:54:40,760
child abuse cases in Canada there was a

1332
00:54:45,730 --> 00:54:43,040
very famous case in Saskatchewan years

1333
00:54:48,460 --> 00:54:45,740
ago where you know it almost became like

1334
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:48,470
the Salem witch trials where children's

1335
00:54:53,100 --> 00:54:51,050
testimony was being colored in that sort

1336
00:54:56,560 --> 00:54:53,110
of thing I think it's a very dangerous

1337
00:54:59,500 --> 00:54:56,570
tool when especially when used by people

1338
00:55:01,600 --> 00:54:59,510
who are not trained as psychologists or

1339
00:55:03,640 --> 00:55:01,610
psychiatrists if you haven't got like

1340
00:55:05,110 --> 00:55:03,650
john mack who went at harvard he went

1341
00:55:06,550 --> 00:55:05,120
through an entire review of what he was

1342
00:55:08,650 --> 00:55:06,560
doing and they said while there were a

1343
00:55:10,540 --> 00:55:08,660
few methodological things that they

1344
00:55:12,100 --> 00:55:10,550
perhaps didn't agree with you know he

1345
00:55:14,590 --> 00:55:12,110
hadn't breached any ethics what he was

1346
00:55:16,660 --> 00:55:14,600
doing was perfectly perfectly fine mack

1347
00:55:19,180 --> 00:55:16,670
is on one hand because you know that's

1348
00:55:21,190 --> 00:55:19,190
what he did but when you take a guy and

1349
00:55:22,780 --> 00:55:21,200
this is not meant as a personal attack

1350
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:22,790
but when you take a guy who's a history

1351
00:55:27,700 --> 00:55:25,850
professor like jacobs or an artist like

1352
00:55:30,370 --> 00:55:27,710
Budd Hopkins and all of a sudden they're

1353
00:55:32,620 --> 00:55:30,380
going around hypnotizing people I think

1354
00:55:33,850 --> 00:55:32,630
that's very dangerous and especially

1355
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:33,860
when you might be dealing with people

1356
00:55:39,190 --> 00:55:37,130
who have you know in some cases severe

1357
00:55:40,870 --> 00:55:39,200
mental problems severe psychiatric

1358
00:55:44,380 --> 00:55:40,880
issues

1359
00:55:48,279 --> 00:55:44,390
and that's the problem I have with the

1360
00:55:50,380 --> 00:55:48,289
abduction phenomenon and people hear me

1361
00:55:53,499 --> 00:55:50,390
say that and I've talked to people in

1362
00:55:55,690 --> 00:55:53,509
the UFO field and they it's amazing

1363
00:55:57,999 --> 00:55:55,700
they will trot out the D bunker label

1364
00:55:59,049 --> 00:55:58,009
and I know Kevin Randle took hits for

1365
00:56:01,180 --> 00:55:59,059
this when he wrote his book the

1366
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:01,190
abduction enigma and basically came to

1367
00:56:07,569 --> 00:56:03,650
the same conclusion about hypnosis but I

1368
00:56:10,359 --> 00:56:07,579
say that if you take all of that out you

1369
00:56:12,309 --> 00:56:10,369
still have as with the UFO phenomenon

1370
00:56:14,230 --> 00:56:12,319
itself I think you still have a small

1371
00:56:16,779 --> 00:56:14,240
number of cases much smaller than

1372
00:56:18,490 --> 00:56:16,789
Hopkins or Jacobson will well sort of

1373
00:56:21,099 --> 00:56:18,500
assert but you still have a small number

1374
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:21,109
of cases that he can explain and this I

1375
00:56:25,150 --> 00:56:23,210
think was John Mack's conclusion that

1376
00:56:27,339 --> 00:56:25,160
are very interesting that deserve

1377
00:56:28,630 --> 00:56:27,349
further research serious scientific

1378
00:56:30,549 --> 00:56:28,640
research because there might be

1379
00:56:33,700 --> 00:56:30,559
something going on and we might learn

1380
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:33,710
something but it doesn't mean that

1381
00:56:37,390 --> 00:56:36,170
they're hybrids from Zeta Reticuli or

1382
00:56:39,819 --> 00:56:37,400
whatever that are planning on taking

1383
00:56:41,620 --> 00:56:39,829
over the earth so the real problem I

1384
00:56:44,589 --> 00:56:41,630
have I suppose is the methodology and

1385
00:56:48,309 --> 00:56:44,599
then also as is the case with so much in

1386
00:56:50,710 --> 00:56:48,319
ufology people taking a certain piece of

1387
00:56:52,599 --> 00:56:50,720
evidence or a certain group of evidence

1388
00:56:54,400 --> 00:56:52,609
and then drawing a conclusion from it

1389
00:56:57,430 --> 00:56:54,410
and saying okay well here's this and

1390
00:57:00,069 --> 00:56:57,440
then it has to be this and I know that's

1391
00:57:02,529 --> 00:57:00,079
one of the things that always annoyed

1392
00:57:04,569 --> 00:57:02,539
Mac and it annoys Greg and Nick and I

1393
00:57:06,160 --> 00:57:04,579
and that's why we all got along so well

1394
00:57:08,019 --> 00:57:06,170
because we would look at the evidence

1395
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:08,029
and say well okay yeah it could be that

1396
00:57:11,200 --> 00:57:09,410
or then it could be that or it could be

1397
00:57:12,609 --> 00:57:11,210
that or it could be that and so I don't

1398
00:57:14,680 --> 00:57:12,619
like the conclusions that I don't like

1399
00:57:17,049 --> 00:57:14,690
the methodology even though I think

1400
00:57:19,509 --> 00:57:17,059
there's still an enigma there that

1401
00:57:22,509 --> 00:57:19,519
deserves serious scientific study so

1402
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:22,519
there that's that's my decisions he has

1403
00:57:29,019 --> 00:57:25,730
right what the Jacobs conclusion is if

1404
00:57:35,410 --> 00:57:29,029
we might recollection pretty wild is

1405
00:57:37,809 --> 00:57:35,420
that the infiltrated by aliens or

1406
00:57:40,299 --> 00:57:37,819
created hybrids they're doing this since

1407
00:57:41,410 --> 00:57:40,309
the late 1870s and at this rate they'll

1408
00:57:45,430 --> 00:57:41,420
have X amount of the population

1409
00:57:48,609 --> 00:57:45,440
converted by exp and holy mackerel look

1410
00:57:50,769 --> 00:57:48,619
out and that's was the basic message and

1411
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:50,779
I feel like this like kind of outlandish

1412
00:57:54,710 --> 00:57:52,970
but at the same time I'm like well you

1413
00:57:57,950 --> 00:57:54,720
know God knows the mania

1414
00:58:00,770 --> 00:57:57,960
who knows that they you know how based

1415
00:58:06,650 --> 00:58:00,780
on you know to me I just looked at it as

1416
00:58:10,700 --> 00:58:06,660
he is assured his public that he has

1417
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:10,710
witnessed has studied many cases and has

1418
00:58:16,270 --> 00:58:12,810
found correlations and has controlled

1419
00:58:19,430 --> 00:58:16,280
questions that weed out obvious face and

1420
00:58:22,700 --> 00:58:19,440
and personally I mean I haven't gone

1421
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:22,710
through his files there's not a lot of

1422
00:58:26,390 --> 00:58:24,090
people who are willing to put what they

1423
00:58:29,090 --> 00:58:26,400
have to say and you know quote unquote

1424
00:58:30,980 --> 00:58:29,100
back it up with research out there in

1425
00:58:33,350 --> 00:58:30,990
book form and on the internet and on the

1426
00:58:35,090 --> 00:58:33,360
lecture circuit you know from my point

1427
00:58:36,380 --> 00:58:35,100
of view as a filmmaker what am I

1428
00:58:39,500 --> 00:58:36,390
supposed to do I mean Who am I supposed

1429
00:58:42,980 --> 00:58:39,510
to talk to you know I mean this guy is a

1430
00:58:44,510 --> 00:58:42,990
widely published and some would say

1431
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:44,520
somebody who is going out on a limb

1432
00:58:49,790 --> 00:58:47,490
considering exact identity sector in the

1433
00:58:51,350 --> 00:58:49,800
field you know why wouldn't we at least

1434
00:58:52,940 --> 00:58:51,360
take a look at what he's saying and I

1435
00:58:54,980 --> 00:58:52,950
think Paul you agree with that it's just

1436
00:58:57,200 --> 00:58:54,990
you're questioning his methodology which

1437
00:58:58,670 --> 00:58:57,210
I can't really comment on I mean I agree

1438
00:58:59,630 --> 00:58:58,680
with a lot of things you say it there

1439
00:59:02,630 --> 00:58:59,640
you know there's nothing I really

1440
00:59:06,770 --> 00:59:02,640
disagree with other than the fact that

1441
00:59:10,190 --> 00:59:06,780
I'm not so sure that hypnosis is suggest

1442
00:59:11,660 --> 00:59:10,200
is as suggestive as maybe you are I'm

1443
00:59:13,040 --> 00:59:11,670
not so sure about that

1444
00:59:14,990 --> 00:59:13,050
and that's something we'll have to

1445
00:59:17,390 --> 00:59:15,000
debate I think a bit more on the other

1446
00:59:18,740 --> 00:59:17,400
side of the show for those who want to

1447
00:59:20,660 --> 00:59:18,750
learn more about the things you do

1448
00:59:24,410 --> 00:59:20,670
Michael McDonald before we start our to

1449
00:59:25,970 --> 00:59:24,420
where do they go but for me the best

1450
00:59:29,600 --> 00:59:25,980
place to see what I'm up to is go to

1451
00:59:33,460 --> 00:59:29,610
IMDB the Internet Movie Database and you

1452
00:59:36,890 --> 00:59:33,470
can go to my name Michael McCaul and

1453
00:59:40,430 --> 00:59:36,900
you'll see you know one of the first

1454
00:59:42,830 --> 00:59:40,440
shows on there other than that I my my

1455
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:42,840
Roadhouse film star see a website is

1456
00:59:46,690 --> 00:59:45,210
down and I'm retooling I'm not quite

1457
00:59:48,890 --> 00:59:46,700
sure what I've never come up with next

1458
00:59:52,400 --> 00:59:48,900
you really want to get a hold of me find

1459
00:59:53,780 --> 00:59:52,410
somebody you know that's how we found

1460
00:59:56,300 --> 00:59:53,790
you that's how we found you we'll have

1461
00:59:58,430 --> 00:59:56,310
more with Michael McDonald on our guest

1462
01:00:01,370 --> 00:59:58,440
co-host Paul Kimble on the other side of

1463
01:00:06,089 --> 01:00:04,320
we want to hear from you if you have a

1464
01:00:09,359 --> 01:00:06,099
comment or question about the pair cast

1465
01:00:12,870 --> 01:00:09,369
send it to news at the pair cast com

1466
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:12,880
that's news at the pair cast calm and

1467
01:00:16,470 --> 01:00:14,770
don't forget to visit our forums where

1468
01:00:19,020 --> 01:00:16,480
you can talk to fellow listeners just go

1469
01:00:21,480 --> 01:00:19,030
to the para cast comm and click on the

1470
01:00:31,380 --> 01:00:21,490
forum links that's the forum links at

1471
01:00:36,220 --> 01:00:31,390
the para cast comm welcome back to the

1472
01:00:40,359 --> 01:00:38,530
all right guest co-host miss Paul

1473
01:00:43,780 --> 01:00:40,369
Kimball and we're talking to filmmaker

1474
01:00:46,570 --> 01:00:43,790
Michael McDonald who did what they call

1475
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:46,580
the definitive story documentary about

1476
01:00:51,730 --> 01:00:49,730
sci-fi legend forry ackerman forever in

1477
01:00:54,849 --> 01:00:51,740
his debt we are because of that and

1478
01:00:57,640 --> 01:00:54,859
before we actually ended part one we

1479
01:01:00,790 --> 01:00:57,650
were talking about UFO abductions the

1480
01:01:03,940 --> 01:01:00,800
elephant in the room and Paul and

1481
01:01:05,859 --> 01:01:03,950
Michael are giving slightly differing

1482
01:01:08,530 --> 01:01:05,869
viewpoints about it the thing that

1483
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:08,540
troubles me about this whole thing about

1484
01:01:13,359 --> 01:01:10,490
dr. Jacobs and he seems like a very nice

1485
01:01:15,609 --> 01:01:13,369
gracious guy very smart guy is this

1486
01:01:17,230 --> 01:01:15,619
alien hybrid thing so are the aliens

1487
01:01:19,150 --> 01:01:17,240
gonna take us over Paul is that what

1488
01:01:22,120 --> 01:01:19,160
it's all about yeah you know he titles

1489
01:01:24,190 --> 01:01:22,130
is one of his books the threat and so I

1490
01:01:25,990 --> 01:01:24,200
don't think he's taking it in the sense

1491
01:01:28,330 --> 01:01:26,000
that oh the aliens are here to help us I

1492
01:01:30,490 --> 01:01:28,340
think that's pretty self-evident and my

1493
01:01:31,690 --> 01:01:30,500
thing about Jacobs who I've met I've sat

1494
01:01:34,510 --> 01:01:31,700
down with him I think it was at the

1495
01:01:35,950 --> 01:01:34,520
Laughlin UFO conference and had a beer

1496
01:01:37,870 --> 01:01:35,960
and chatted with him and Nick Pope and a

1497
01:01:42,340 --> 01:01:37,880
few others for about an hour so he is a

1498
01:01:45,340 --> 01:01:42,350
very nice man in person but if anybody

1499
01:01:46,750 --> 01:01:45,350
from the exo politics movement and I

1500
01:01:49,330 --> 01:01:46,760
like your people on the board who are

1501
01:01:51,550 --> 01:01:49,340
sort of defending dr. Jacobs not the

1502
01:01:52,540 --> 01:01:51,560
person but what he does let's remember

1503
01:01:55,300 --> 01:01:52,550
to separate the two

1504
01:01:58,090 --> 01:01:55,310
if anybody like Alfred Webber or Steven

1505
01:02:00,820 --> 01:01:58,100
Greer or Steven Bassett was to say the

1506
01:02:02,620 --> 01:02:00,830
things that dr. Jacobs says alien

1507
01:02:04,060 --> 01:02:02,630
hybrids threatening to take over the

1508
01:02:07,030 --> 01:02:04,070
earth they've been here since the late

1509
01:02:08,920 --> 01:02:07,040
19th century they would be laughed out

1510
01:02:11,650 --> 01:02:08,930
of the room by some of the same people

1511
01:02:13,780 --> 01:02:11,660
who I think are defending Jacobs work in

1512
01:02:15,460 --> 01:02:13,790
the abduction thing and so I think

1513
01:02:16,300 --> 01:02:15,470
people have to ask themselves well okay

1514
01:02:19,780 --> 01:02:16,310
why is that

1515
01:02:22,420 --> 01:02:19,790
is it because dr. Jacobs has a degree a

1516
01:02:24,400 --> 01:02:22,430
PhD in history and tenure at Temple

1517
01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:24,410
University I think yeah that's probably

1518
01:02:29,020 --> 01:02:27,050
why it is is it because dr. Jacobs has

1519
01:02:31,900 --> 01:02:29,030
done some good work on the history of

1520
01:02:34,060 --> 01:02:31,910
the UFO phenomenon and he did before

1521
01:02:35,950 --> 01:02:34,070
yeah I think that's true too but just

1522
01:02:38,680 --> 01:02:35,960
because somebody's done good work in one

1523
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:38,690
area in the past doesn't mean that they

1524
01:02:42,910 --> 01:02:40,970
get a free pass in the present and I

1525
01:02:45,700 --> 01:02:42,920
think that's like the case let's talk

1526
01:02:49,590 --> 01:02:45,710
about the actual work done let's talk

1527
01:02:52,230 --> 01:02:49,600
about his research sure and and I

1528
01:02:54,720 --> 01:02:52,240
I'm not an expert in this guy's on the

1529
01:02:56,730 --> 01:02:54,730
documentary documentarian I've done UFO

1530
01:02:59,010 --> 01:02:56,740
film but I don't suppose to be an expert

1531
01:03:02,280 --> 01:02:59,020
in this and I know you don't either and

1532
01:03:05,940 --> 01:03:02,290
from my point of view you know here's a

1533
01:03:10,290 --> 01:03:05,950
guy who said what I've taken the time

1534
01:03:13,110 --> 01:03:10,300
any energy to do these hypnosis

1535
01:03:15,510 --> 01:03:13,120
regression therapy sessions with these

1536
01:03:17,850 --> 01:03:15,520
people and here's the data I have

1537
01:03:19,950 --> 01:03:17,860
collected and here are the conditions of

1538
01:03:23,100 --> 01:03:19,960
which I collected the data and here are

1539
01:03:25,920 --> 01:03:23,110
the control questions that I put in to

1540
01:03:29,820 --> 01:03:25,930
the process right here's the data that I

1541
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:29,830
have right in point form for you to mull

1542
01:03:36,810 --> 01:03:33,850
over here is my conclusion right I can't

1543
01:03:41,340 --> 01:03:36,820
see how that's any different as a matter

1544
01:03:44,730 --> 01:03:41,350
of fact is more of a methodical and to

1545
01:03:46,620 --> 01:03:44,740
procedure than some of the writings of

1546
01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:46,630
Everett from the other authors and

1547
01:03:53,340 --> 01:03:50,170
experts in the UFO field and the only

1548
01:03:56,190 --> 01:03:53,350
thing that I could argue to is that the

1549
01:03:59,340 --> 01:03:56,200
question of whether or not using

1550
01:04:02,670 --> 01:03:59,350
hypnosis is valid or invalid in getting

1551
01:04:05,580 --> 01:04:02,680
information on abduction experiences and

1552
01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:05,590
that's to me the the nub of the question

1553
01:04:12,030 --> 01:04:09,130
you know who else has done research with

1554
01:04:14,340 --> 01:04:12,040
regards to hypnosis in regards to

1555
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:14,350
whether or not hallucinations occur or

1556
01:04:17,730 --> 01:04:17,050
suggestive actions are induced in

1557
01:04:19,860 --> 01:04:17,740
hypnosis

1558
01:04:22,770 --> 01:04:19,870
that's my question well I think there's

1559
01:04:24,510 --> 01:04:22,780
there's a large number of people in sort

1560
01:04:26,910 --> 01:04:24,520
of psychiatric profession that have done

1561
01:04:30,330 --> 01:04:26,920
exactly that research into it I'm not

1562
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:30,340
saying that hypnosis is completely

1563
01:04:36,180 --> 01:04:33,250
worthless I'm saying that I think

1564
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:36,190
hypnosis when done by people who have

1565
01:04:39,660 --> 01:04:38,050
already made up their minds and I think

1566
01:04:43,440 --> 01:04:39,670
in the case of dr. Jacobs and Budd

1567
01:04:46,050 --> 01:04:43,450
Hopkins that's absolutely true I'm sorry

1568
01:04:50,580 --> 01:04:46,060
to interrupt but over and over again

1569
01:04:52,740 --> 01:04:50,590
that he did not make up his mind before

1570
01:04:55,710 --> 01:04:52,750
he collected the data that this was a

1571
01:04:58,080 --> 01:04:55,720
result of him parsing the information

1572
01:04:59,520 --> 01:04:58,090
and the conclusion that he came up with

1573
01:05:02,010 --> 01:04:59,530
and that he had

1574
01:05:03,780 --> 01:05:02,020
we grapple with that he was brutally

1575
01:05:07,020 --> 01:05:03,790
honest with himself about that in his

1576
01:05:09,180 --> 01:05:07,030
writing and in his presentations and in

1577
01:05:11,100 --> 01:05:09,190
his personal conversation well and I

1578
01:05:13,500 --> 01:05:11,110
would say that even if I accept that let

1579
01:05:15,630 --> 01:05:13,510
me say that okay so I accept that then I

1580
01:05:16,950 --> 01:05:15,640
would say he's flat-out wrong in the

1581
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:16,960
same way that I would say and you raised

1582
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:18,370
an interesting point about UFO

1583
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:20,410
researchers in general you're right a

1584
01:05:23,580 --> 01:05:22,570
lot of what he's saying is is not that

1585
01:05:25,740 --> 01:05:23,590
was the point I was trying to make

1586
01:05:27,300 --> 01:05:25,750
earlier about the the exo politics guys

1587
01:05:28,950 --> 01:05:27,310
it's not all that different than what

1588
01:05:32,130 --> 01:05:28,960
some people on the fringes of ufology

1589
01:05:33,660 --> 01:05:32,140
are saying but what strikes me is weird

1590
01:05:36,960 --> 01:05:33,670
and a little hypocritical from some of

1591
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:36,970
the mainline UFO researchers is that if

1592
01:05:41,310 --> 01:05:39,970
somebody like Steven Greer said this and

1593
01:05:43,650 --> 01:05:41,320
I'm not sure if you're familiar with the

1594
01:05:46,200 --> 01:05:43,660
XO Paul's Mike with the analytics

1595
01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:46,210
movement but if some of them said it

1596
01:05:51,690 --> 01:05:47,770
they would be laughed out of the room

1597
01:05:53,400 --> 01:05:51,700
but when dr. Jacobs says it guys like

1598
01:05:55,440 --> 01:05:53,410
and I don't want to pick on Stan but

1599
01:05:57,330 --> 01:05:55,450
guys like Stan Friedman and other of you

1600
01:05:59,580 --> 01:05:57,340
know the older UFO researchers that have

1601
01:06:01,020 --> 01:05:59,590
known Jacobs for many years will look

1602
01:06:02,550 --> 01:06:01,030
and say well because it's David Jacobs

1603
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:02,560
that's saying this and drawing this

1604
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:04,330
conclusion we have to take it seriously

1605
01:06:10,230 --> 01:06:07,450
and I would say why like what blossom

1606
01:06:11,550 --> 01:06:10,240
character did but it's not it shouldn't

1607
01:06:12,420 --> 01:06:11,560
be about character though it should be

1608
01:06:14,490 --> 01:06:12,430
about evidence

1609
01:06:17,340 --> 01:06:14,500
you should look I think it's about a

1610
01:06:19,410 --> 01:06:17,350
trusting of the person to to ask

1611
01:06:21,990 --> 01:06:19,420
themselves seriously the same question

1612
01:06:23,660 --> 01:06:22,000
to come to an irrefutable answer in

1613
01:06:26,700 --> 01:06:23,670
their own mind that yes this is what

1614
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:26,710
therefore this is what I have to say and

1615
01:06:31,350 --> 01:06:28,890
I would say that everybody is you know

1616
01:06:32,820 --> 01:06:31,360
eligible to make a conclusion well

1617
01:06:38,430 --> 01:06:32,830
that's my only point whether he's right

1618
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:38,440
or wrong I don't know that's why I you

1619
01:06:42,600 --> 01:06:39,970
know several times in different

1620
01:06:44,340 --> 01:06:42,610
documentaries it's because you know

1621
01:06:46,530 --> 01:06:44,350
here's a guy who's actually stating his

1622
01:06:48,060 --> 01:06:46,540
case saying he has the data saying he

1623
01:06:50,520 --> 01:06:48,070
has the file to back it up here's his

1624
01:06:51,780 --> 01:06:50,530
conclusions definitely you know not

1625
01:06:53,550 --> 01:06:51,790
professing to be an expert in the

1626
01:06:55,560 --> 01:06:53,560
subject but then again not saying he's

1627
01:06:57,900 --> 01:06:55,570
not I understand that and you know you

1628
01:06:59,670 --> 01:06:57,910
look at the spam and if it was yourself

1629
01:07:02,340 --> 01:06:59,680
I would I would feel just as comfortable

1630
01:07:04,500 --> 01:07:02,350
having your opinions you know in one of

1631
01:07:05,820 --> 01:07:04,510
my documentaries absolutely you know

1632
01:07:07,470 --> 01:07:05,830
rather than you know there's a whole

1633
01:07:09,720 --> 01:07:07,480
fringe element out there of like

1634
01:07:12,150 --> 01:07:09,730
weirdness like you know this new-age

1635
01:07:14,220 --> 01:07:12,160
sort of fusion with

1636
01:07:16,290 --> 01:07:14,230
and that I can't even get my hand around

1637
01:07:19,410 --> 01:07:16,300
but at least you guys all of you guys

1638
01:07:21,240 --> 01:07:19,420
have plausible ideas you know they may

1639
01:07:24,330 --> 01:07:21,250
not be bulletproof in my mind all of

1640
01:07:31,500 --> 01:07:24,340
them but they they all have you know you

1641
01:07:33,630 --> 01:07:31,510
know fairly solid foundations for well

1642
01:07:35,790 --> 01:07:33,640
if I was doing a documentary on the

1643
01:07:37,710 --> 01:07:35,800
alien abduction phenomenon I would have

1644
01:07:39,630 --> 01:07:37,720
dr. Jacobs in the film if I could get

1645
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:39,640
him I'd have Budd Hopkins in the film so

1646
01:07:43,230 --> 01:07:41,410
and you raise another interesting point

1647
01:07:45,570 --> 01:07:43,240
which all I'll ask you about in just a

1648
01:07:47,430 --> 01:07:45,580
second I would just say that and my last

1649
01:07:49,470 --> 01:07:47,440
word on this is I think dr. Jacobs is

1650
01:07:57,840 --> 01:07:49,480
the fringe especially when he starts

1651
01:07:59,820 --> 01:07:57,850
talking about hybrids and stuff oh well

1652
01:08:01,980 --> 01:07:59,830
I didn't say he was at the fringe of the

1653
01:08:03,990 --> 01:08:01,990
fringe I've seen that too but I think

1654
01:08:05,820 --> 01:08:04,000
he's moved out on to the you know if

1655
01:08:08,070 --> 01:08:05,830
there's a true if there's a tree limb as

1656
01:08:09,990 --> 01:08:08,080
Frank Scully would say he's moved out to

1657
01:08:12,480 --> 01:08:10,000
the edge of the tree limb because that's

1658
01:08:14,370 --> 01:08:12,490
where the fruit can be found yeah and I

1659
01:08:16,530 --> 01:08:14,380
agree with you is it because is it

1660
01:08:18,900 --> 01:08:16,540
because of the fact of what he says it's

1661
01:08:22,020 --> 01:08:18,910
so outlandish and and and almost like a

1662
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:22,030
Western story you know it's like it's

1663
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:24,010
like you know we're the Indians and and

1664
01:08:28,470 --> 01:08:27,130
and this is the great Far East coming to

1665
01:08:31,230 --> 01:08:28,480
get us you know I mean it's got that

1666
01:08:33,060 --> 01:08:31,240
sort of element to you know and so it

1667
01:08:36,810 --> 01:08:33,070
makes it it puts it into a sort of like

1668
01:08:40,700 --> 01:08:36,820
a a fantasy world for sure okay so the

1669
01:08:43,140 --> 01:08:40,710
aliens are Cowboys from the future yeah

1670
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:43,150
to me it would be like Mike if you and I

1671
01:08:47,730 --> 01:08:44,890
for those who are listening we both live

1672
01:08:50,040 --> 01:08:47,740
in Halifax so we we both you and I and

1673
01:08:51,960 --> 01:08:50,050
dr. Jacobs are all in Halifax we all

1674
01:08:53,850 --> 01:08:51,970
take a car and we all drive across the

1675
01:08:55,560 --> 01:08:53,860
bridge to Dartmouth you and I get there

1676
01:08:57,000 --> 01:08:55,570
and we go hey where are we we're in

1677
01:08:58,830 --> 01:08:57,010
Dartmouth how do we get her we drove

1678
01:09:00,750 --> 01:08:58,840
across the bridge what I think dr.

1679
01:09:03,180 --> 01:09:00,760
Jacobs and others that have done this

1680
01:09:05,400 --> 01:09:03,190
have done they would get there you turn

1681
01:09:08,610 --> 01:09:05,410
to them and say hey where are you and

1682
01:09:11,790 --> 01:09:08,620
he'd say I'm in Montreal really and well

1683
01:09:15,600 --> 01:09:11,800
how did you get here I took a plane even

1684
01:09:17,430 --> 01:09:15,610
though he got he's in Montreal he drove

1685
01:09:19,380 --> 01:09:17,440
up there he flew a plane even though he

1686
01:09:21,330 --> 01:09:19,390
did the same thing that we did where as

1687
01:09:23,310 --> 01:09:21,340
we took a car and we're actually where

1688
01:09:24,930 --> 01:09:23,320
we are but on the question of

1689
01:09:25,979 --> 01:09:24,940
documentaries because you said something

1690
01:09:28,620 --> 01:09:25,989
you know you're just out

1691
01:09:30,479 --> 01:09:28,630
men treemaker making films and I'm the

1692
01:09:33,299 --> 01:09:30,489
same thing I did a film on majestic 12

1693
01:09:35,549 --> 01:09:33,309
and I left it open for people to I said

1694
01:09:38,249 --> 01:09:35,559
look here stands evidence here's the

1695
01:09:40,559 --> 01:09:38,259
people who disagree with majestic 12 and

1696
01:09:41,609 --> 01:09:40,569
you know its documentary makers I think

1697
01:09:43,709 --> 01:09:41,619
at the end of the day we have two

1698
01:09:46,109 --> 01:09:43,719
choices one we can we can get involved

1699
01:09:48,419 --> 01:09:46,119
and take a position which I sort of

1700
01:09:50,039 --> 01:09:48,429
didn't best evidence and the other is

1701
01:09:51,809 --> 01:09:50,049
what we usually do most of the time

1702
01:09:54,330 --> 01:09:51,819
which is to try and put the information

1703
01:09:56,009 --> 01:09:54,340
out there and then let the viewer make

1704
01:09:58,160 --> 01:09:56,019
up their own mind is that sort of how

1705
01:10:00,689 --> 01:09:58,170
you approach it Mike my approach was

1706
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:00,699
based on my own personal opinion which

1707
01:10:04,560 --> 01:10:03,010
is there's something going on I'm not

1708
01:10:06,989 --> 01:10:04,570
quite sure what it is

1709
01:10:10,009 --> 01:10:06,999
it could be nuts and bolt UFOs it could

1710
01:10:12,810 --> 01:10:10,019
be some sort of weird interdimensional

1711
01:10:14,879 --> 01:10:12,820
coexistence I don't know what it is it

1712
01:10:17,279 --> 01:10:14,889
could be both but there's definitely

1713
01:10:19,649 --> 01:10:17,289
something going on absolutely if you

1714
01:10:22,020 --> 01:10:19,659
look at the information and the stories

1715
01:10:24,870 --> 01:10:22,030
and the data over hundreds and hundreds

1716
01:10:27,899 --> 01:10:24,880
if not longer years it's something going

1717
01:10:29,700 --> 01:10:27,909
on so I definitely took a stand that you

1718
01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:29,710
know you should you should pay attention

1719
01:10:34,049 --> 01:10:32,530
to this it is it is significant and it's

1720
01:10:36,209 --> 01:10:34,059
Chris Kyle said in one of my

1721
01:10:38,060 --> 01:10:36,219
documentaries is that either way it's oh

1722
01:10:40,979 --> 01:10:38,070
it's a knoll it's a no-lose situation

1723
01:10:43,500 --> 01:10:40,989
because it turns out that there are

1724
01:10:45,779 --> 01:10:43,510
aliens in our universe or I should say

1725
01:10:47,370 --> 01:10:45,789
other other civilizations in their

1726
01:10:48,839 --> 01:10:47,380
universe and we get to interface with

1727
01:10:51,000 --> 01:10:48,849
them how amazing is that

1728
01:10:53,939 --> 01:10:51,010
is that an employee chance that we are

1729
01:10:57,359 --> 01:10:53,949
the only ones in the others then how

1730
01:10:59,520 --> 01:10:57,369
precious we are you know and and terms

1731
01:11:02,220 --> 01:10:59,530
of origin in terms of motivations from

1732
01:11:04,589 --> 01:11:02,230
those but I definitely in my in my

1733
01:11:06,629 --> 01:11:04,599
documentaries took the side this is

1734
01:11:08,220 --> 01:11:06,639
important this is not frivolous I'm not

1735
01:11:11,040 --> 01:11:08,230
gonna stand on the fence like a

1736
01:11:13,770 --> 01:11:11,050
journalist on CNN you know you've got

1737
01:11:16,100 --> 01:11:13,780
you need to take notice of it but I try

1738
01:11:19,830 --> 01:11:16,110
my best to just let the people that I

1739
01:11:21,930 --> 01:11:19,840
interview and that I profile to tell

1740
01:11:23,939 --> 01:11:21,940
tell us what they think right I think by

1741
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:23,949
doing the film's we've already unless

1742
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:25,449
you think that people are just doing it

1743
01:11:29,009 --> 01:11:27,489
for dirty filthy lucre as they say I

1744
01:11:30,509 --> 01:11:29,019
think you've already taken a position to

1745
01:11:32,819 --> 01:11:30,519
in the sense that you say look this is a

1746
01:11:35,850 --> 01:11:32,829
valuable subject that deserves

1747
01:11:38,550 --> 01:11:35,860
consideration that's a really good thing

1748
01:11:40,860 --> 01:11:38,560
you brought up dirty filthy lucre

1749
01:11:43,890 --> 01:11:40,870
question is and it's a valid question is

1750
01:11:46,170 --> 01:11:43,900
is it wrong to profit you know to make

1751
01:11:48,990 --> 01:11:46,180
money from the research and discussion

1752
01:11:53,730 --> 01:11:49,000
of UFOs and I know that that polarizes

1753
01:11:55,020 --> 01:11:53,740
people my personal opinion is is you

1754
01:11:57,540 --> 01:11:55,030
know every field of research has

1755
01:11:59,640 --> 01:11:57,550
professionals and you know yes it's more

1756
01:12:00,630 --> 01:11:59,650
freelance but you know does that mean

1757
01:12:03,080 --> 01:12:00,640
that because you're actually making

1758
01:12:08,370 --> 01:12:03,090
money selling books like Stan or whoever

1759
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:08,380
that that you sold out I was just gonna

1760
01:12:11,970 --> 01:12:10,090
say I have a lot of disagreements with

1761
01:12:14,310 --> 01:12:11,980
Stan about substantive issues but the

1762
01:12:16,590 --> 01:12:14,320
one thing that I I will always I think

1763
01:12:18,840 --> 01:12:16,600
Stan's a great guy but you hear people

1764
01:12:20,940 --> 01:12:18,850
criticize him for they say oh well he's

1765
01:12:23,100 --> 01:12:20,950
just in it for the money or his nuclear

1766
01:12:25,110 --> 01:12:23,110
his career in nuclear physics sort of

1767
01:12:27,690 --> 01:12:25,120
blew up no pun intended in the late 60s

1768
01:12:29,010 --> 01:12:27,700
which is true and he went into UFO

1769
01:12:31,110 --> 01:12:29,020
research because he had to pay for the

1770
01:12:32,910 --> 01:12:31,120
house or whatever and I've known stand

1771
01:12:34,410 --> 01:12:32,920
for 30 years yes he makes money off it

1772
01:12:36,960 --> 01:12:34,420
yes he has a nice house in Fredericton

1773
01:12:39,990 --> 01:12:36,970
so what I mean in the end of the day

1774
01:12:43,320 --> 01:12:40,000
nobody says that about Seth Shostak or

1775
01:12:44,880 --> 01:12:43,330
no Misha ikkaku or the guy who's if you

1776
01:12:46,440 --> 01:12:44,890
want to just talk science you know the

1777
01:12:47,550 --> 01:12:46,450
guy who's running the observatory here

1778
01:12:50,340 --> 01:12:47,560
in Halifax at Saint Mary's University

1779
01:12:52,080 --> 01:12:50,350
they make a living off it so why

1780
01:12:54,900 --> 01:12:52,090
shouldn't somebody make living off of

1781
01:12:56,160 --> 01:12:54,910
researching the UFO phenomenon and I

1782
01:12:59,100 --> 01:12:56,170
would say if you can actually make a

1783
01:13:00,510 --> 01:12:59,110
living off it good good for you I mean

1784
01:13:11,430 --> 01:13:00,520
that's if you can actually make a living

1785
01:13:16,959 --> 01:13:14,169
hey neighbors would you like to see the

1786
01:13:18,669 --> 01:13:16,969
power cast live long and prosper well if

1787
01:13:21,009 --> 01:13:18,679
you know of anyone who wants to

1788
01:13:23,140 --> 01:13:21,019
advertise their products or services on

1789
01:13:25,899 --> 01:13:23,150
the power cast have them contact us

1790
01:13:29,500 --> 01:13:25,909
directly tell them to write to sales at

1791
01:13:32,439 --> 01:13:29,510
the para cast com that's sales and for

1792
01:13:35,080 --> 01:13:32,449
para cast come and we also accept your

1793
01:13:37,810 --> 01:13:35,090
donations by PayPal send your PayPal

1794
01:13:40,959 --> 01:13:37,820
donation to the same address sales at

1795
01:13:47,430 --> 01:13:40,969
Lapera cast calm at sales of the power

1796
01:13:53,380 --> 01:13:50,610
this is the bear gasps you never know

1797
01:13:56,850 --> 01:13:53,390
what's next

1798
01:14:01,960 --> 01:13:59,950
we have Paul Kimball's our special guest

1799
01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:01,970
house filmmaker Michael McDonald who

1800
01:14:06,510 --> 01:14:04,370
evidently has made some money on making

1801
01:14:09,670 --> 01:14:06,520
documentary films but that should not

1802
01:14:11,620 --> 01:14:09,680
you know that should not dictate whether

1803
01:14:13,870 --> 01:14:11,630
we believe or accept them or not I mean

1804
01:14:16,780 --> 01:14:13,880
let's look at it this way even though

1805
01:14:19,330 --> 01:14:16,790
there are certain elements of television

1806
01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:19,340
news that we find polarizing the

1807
01:14:24,730 --> 01:14:22,970
mainstream Network newscasters make

1808
01:14:26,290 --> 01:14:24,740
millions of dollars a year but we never

1809
01:14:32,050 --> 01:14:26,300
assume they're just telling us lies

1810
01:14:33,910 --> 01:14:32,060
doing well I do well the whole question

1811
01:14:36,070 --> 01:14:33,920
so basically we now know what's going on

1812
01:14:39,490 --> 01:14:36,080
Paul Campbell says they're telling us

1813
01:14:41,290 --> 01:14:39,500
lies end of story well I just assumed

1814
01:14:42,850 --> 01:14:41,300
that and there I don't assume that

1815
01:14:44,260 --> 01:14:42,860
they're consciously telling us lies I

1816
01:14:46,180 --> 01:14:44,270
think that they think they're telling us

1817
01:14:47,950 --> 01:14:46,190
the truth I just assumed that they're

1818
01:14:50,440 --> 01:14:47,960
probably not telling us the truth now

1819
01:14:52,270 --> 01:14:50,450
I'm always happy to be proven wrong and

1820
01:14:54,280 --> 01:14:52,280
I usually am but I think it's safer that

1821
01:14:56,590 --> 01:14:54,290
we start on the assumption that what

1822
01:14:57,880 --> 01:14:56,600
we're hearing might not be true and then

1823
01:14:59,710 --> 01:14:57,890
let's make sure that they can actually

1824
01:15:02,230 --> 01:14:59,720
show us that it's true as opposed to

1825
01:15:03,880 --> 01:15:02,240
just sitting there and going oh yes that

1826
01:15:06,340 --> 01:15:03,890
must be true because somebody in

1827
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:06,350
authority said that and in the UFO stuff

1828
01:15:10,270 --> 01:15:07,970
I would say the same thing if Stan

1829
01:15:12,520 --> 01:15:10,280
Friedman I've seen this happen because

1830
01:15:14,920 --> 01:15:12,530
he has such a reputation and largely

1831
01:15:17,860 --> 01:15:14,930
well deserved he can stand in front of a

1832
01:15:20,080 --> 01:15:17,870
crowd and I'm convinced that stand in

1833
01:15:21,820 --> 01:15:20,090
front of many crowds could say up is

1834
01:15:23,290 --> 01:15:21,830
down and down is up black is white and

1835
01:15:25,480 --> 01:15:23,300
white is black and they would believe

1836
01:15:27,910 --> 01:15:25,490
him because it's Stan Friedman telling

1837
01:15:29,740 --> 01:15:27,920
them that and that's a mistake

1838
01:15:31,840 --> 01:15:29,750
you know nobody should get a free pass

1839
01:15:38,860 --> 01:15:31,850
no matter what your credentials are what

1840
01:15:41,200 --> 01:15:38,870
your record is he gets a free pass all

1841
01:15:43,060 --> 01:15:41,210
the time at these UFO conferences I've

1842
01:15:44,680 --> 01:15:43,070
listened to stand more than once and and

1843
01:15:46,630 --> 01:15:44,690
there's some times when I think Stan you

1844
01:15:49,360 --> 01:15:46,640
were the spark of the UFO world you use

1845
01:15:49,870 --> 01:15:49,370
logic in the beautiful ways and and I

1846
01:15:52,420 --> 01:15:49,880
don't

1847
01:15:53,710 --> 01:15:52,430
I couldn't characterize I cut it rather

1848
01:15:55,570 --> 01:15:53,720
than you want to use that where they I

1849
01:15:58,150 --> 01:15:55,580
couldn't characterize what he says in

1850
01:15:59,830 --> 01:15:58,160
that way I mean he does have some points

1851
01:16:02,260 --> 01:15:59,840
there's no doubt about it in a

1852
01:16:04,840 --> 01:16:02,270
technological society if you're - if

1853
01:16:05,950 --> 01:16:04,850
you're trying to you know discover a new

1854
01:16:07,090 --> 01:16:05,960
world one of the first things you're

1855
01:16:09,510 --> 01:16:07,100
going to do is you're going to test the

1856
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:09,520
defense system so obviously you

1857
01:16:13,890 --> 01:16:11,890
would congregate around the fence

1858
01:16:15,630 --> 01:16:13,900
systems and that they would test defense

1859
01:16:17,550 --> 01:16:15,640
systems why wouldn't you wouldn't you do

1860
01:16:19,140 --> 01:16:17,560
that and you know what whether stances

1861
01:16:21,150 --> 01:16:19,150
or whether I say that's a compelling

1862
01:16:23,100 --> 01:16:21,160
very good well it's it's to a point a

1863
01:16:25,860 --> 01:16:23,110
compelling argument although I would say

1864
01:16:28,200 --> 01:16:25,870
that if the aliens can get here from

1865
01:16:31,380 --> 01:16:28,210
there and let's even assume that there

1866
01:16:33,570 --> 01:16:31,390
is the nearest possible star system they

1867
01:16:37,710 --> 01:16:33,580
are so technologically advanced beyond

1868
01:16:39,570 --> 01:16:37,720
where we are that at best their survey

1869
01:16:42,690 --> 01:16:39,580
of our defensive systems should take

1870
01:16:44,460 --> 01:16:42,700
them a day or two and then at that point

1871
01:16:46,770 --> 01:16:44,470
they would know that nothing we have can

1872
01:16:49,110 --> 01:16:46,780
actually do them any real harm except by

1873
01:16:53,520 --> 01:16:49,120
the way if they send Jeff Goldblum of

1874
01:16:57,330 --> 01:16:53,530
the 1996 PowerBook 500 and connects

1875
01:17:00,000 --> 01:16:57,340
wirelessly to the alien control system

1876
01:17:02,340 --> 01:17:00,010
and then sends a virus and that's it

1877
01:17:04,860 --> 01:17:02,350
that's all we need are you listening

1878
01:17:07,620 --> 01:17:04,870
yeah the savior of humanity Jeff

1879
01:17:09,450 --> 01:17:07,630
Goldblum and Will Smith yeah fascinating

1880
01:17:15,180 --> 01:17:09,460
I do love that movie though where this

1881
01:17:16,230 --> 01:17:15,190
what is he the defense secretary the

1882
01:17:17,460 --> 01:17:16,240
president goes well we've never

1883
01:17:18,990 --> 01:17:17,470
recovered anything in the defense

1884
01:17:22,520 --> 01:17:19,000
secretary Steph's warning to us well mr.

1885
01:17:26,520 --> 01:17:22,530
president that's not actually quite true

1886
01:17:28,680 --> 01:17:26,530
and they're actually at area 51 at 51

1887
01:17:29,640 --> 01:17:28,690
who do they have as a chief scientist at

1888
01:17:33,690 --> 01:17:29,650
area 51

1889
01:17:35,490 --> 01:17:33,700
data from generations I thought it was

1890
01:17:45,090 --> 01:17:35,500
Bob Lazar yeah I think he's playing Bob

1891
01:17:48,980 --> 01:17:45,100
Lazar when a credits minor yeah why does

1892
01:17:51,150 --> 01:17:48,990
he do these days well if you were

1893
01:17:52,650 --> 01:17:51,160
listening to one Twitter it seemed like

1894
01:17:55,410 --> 01:17:52,660
he was living in a hotel for a while but

1895
01:17:56,760 --> 01:17:55,420
I think he was just joking that business

1896
01:18:00,330 --> 01:17:56,770
was so bad that he had to live in the

1897
01:18:02,010 --> 01:18:00,340
hotel on Hollywood Bowl you know I'm

1898
01:18:03,810 --> 01:18:02,020
sure he's getting you know residual

1899
01:18:06,270 --> 01:18:03,820
checks or whatever from Star Trek see

1900
01:18:08,190 --> 01:18:06,280
the abomination ex generation I was

1901
01:18:12,330 --> 01:18:08,200
gonna say the abomination we would have

1902
01:18:14,760 --> 01:18:12,340
learned from the first yeah cuz you

1903
01:18:17,010 --> 01:18:14,770
don't know why you're living in a

1904
01:18:21,540 --> 01:18:17,020
trailer down by the river or whatever he

1905
01:18:23,220 --> 01:18:21,550
was doing there for a while not sure you

1906
01:18:25,890 --> 01:18:23,230
know so many people have had UFO

1907
01:18:28,350 --> 01:18:25,900
experiences the weird thing is when you

1908
01:18:30,360 --> 01:18:28,360
talk I've never had one Stan's never had

1909
01:18:33,810 --> 01:18:30,370
one I don't mike you've never had one

1910
01:18:36,420 --> 01:18:33,820
heavy not waiting yeah most UFO

1911
01:18:38,460 --> 01:18:36,430
researchers seem not to have head

1912
01:18:44,070 --> 01:18:38,470
I know Mac had never had one I don't

1913
01:18:45,810 --> 01:18:44,080
think Nick Redfern has ever had one but

1914
01:18:48,000 --> 01:18:45,820
they don't seem to be UFO researchers

1915
01:18:50,670 --> 01:18:48,010
with a few exemptions like Don let your

1916
01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:50,680
head one write the shag card and that's

1917
01:18:54,600 --> 01:18:52,210
what I love about the anecdotal evidence

1918
01:18:56,610 --> 01:18:54,610
that people use you know people who just

1919
01:18:59,130 --> 01:18:56,620
don't care don't give a rest you know

1920
01:19:00,720 --> 01:18:59,140
what about UFOs and these incredible

1921
01:19:02,820 --> 01:19:00,730
experiences if they can't understand

1922
01:19:05,700 --> 01:19:02,830
they describe in such a manner that

1923
01:19:07,920 --> 01:19:05,710
falls into the classification and then

1924
01:19:09,390 --> 01:19:07,930
you know figured out over the years it's

1925
01:19:12,960 --> 01:19:09,400
incredible still happens all the time

1926
01:19:14,430 --> 01:19:12,970
but now with YouTube internet hoaxes out

1927
01:19:16,410 --> 01:19:14,440
there but there's a lot of really

1928
01:19:20,550 --> 01:19:16,420
interesting footage there's nothing out

1929
01:19:22,770 --> 01:19:20,560
there on film well it's amazing to me

1930
01:19:24,240 --> 01:19:22,780
how many people like it gets poo-pooed

1931
01:19:26,520 --> 01:19:24,250
it's not reported in the mainstream

1932
01:19:28,770 --> 01:19:26,530
media and yet how many people are

1933
01:19:31,890 --> 01:19:28,780
interested in the UFO subject even today

1934
01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:31,900
after all it's gone through scandals of

1935
01:19:35,790 --> 01:19:34,930
mj-12 and the the blow ups in the 90s

1936
01:19:38,340 --> 01:19:35,800
with in ufology

1937
01:19:39,690 --> 01:19:38,350
and the truth is here's a you know memo

1938
01:19:41,040 --> 01:19:39,700
to you when you follow G if you're

1939
01:19:44,280 --> 01:19:41,050
listening nobody cares

1940
01:19:46,050 --> 01:19:44,290
you're irrelevant the UFO phenomenon

1941
01:19:47,850 --> 01:19:46,060
exists outside the narrow world of

1942
01:19:50,640 --> 01:19:47,860
ufology and all the are petty little

1943
01:19:52,380 --> 01:19:50,650
infighting and I know this because every

1944
01:19:54,060 --> 01:19:52,390
time I've hung out with Stan not at

1945
01:19:55,890 --> 01:19:54,070
conferences but just anywhere people

1946
01:19:57,960 --> 01:19:55,900
will come up to him and just talk to him

1947
01:19:59,820 --> 01:19:57,970
because they know they have experiences

1948
01:20:02,100 --> 01:19:59,830
they have questions they're fascinated I

1949
01:20:04,530 --> 01:20:02,110
was I had lunch with Don Leger once at

1950
01:20:05,970 --> 01:20:04,540
the shoe shop which Mike would know is a

1951
01:20:08,370 --> 01:20:05,980
you know a nice restaurant here in

1952
01:20:10,350 --> 01:20:08,380
Halifax it was nicer than than it is now

1953
01:20:13,920 --> 01:20:10,360
and we're just sitting there and this

1954
01:20:16,650 --> 01:20:13,930
guy walks up to dawn and says you're Don

1955
01:20:18,479 --> 01:20:16,660
Leger now if you know Don he's not

1956
01:20:21,360 --> 01:20:18,489
exactly the kind of guy that most people

1957
01:20:23,400 --> 01:20:21,370
would walk he's not a star but he walks

1958
01:20:25,800 --> 01:20:23,410
and goes you're Don Leger and I'm Wow

1959
01:20:26,490 --> 01:20:25,810
okay you know and Don immediately knew

1960
01:20:29,100 --> 01:20:26,500
what was coming

1961
01:20:31,110 --> 01:20:29,110
lunch over because the guy sat down and

1962
01:20:33,390 --> 01:20:31,120
he spent 40 minutes telling us his UFO

1963
01:20:35,070 --> 01:20:33,400
story and Don listened patiently had a

1964
01:20:36,500 --> 01:20:35,080
chat said here's my number give me a

1965
01:20:40,220 --> 01:20:36,510
call if you want to talk for

1966
01:20:41,990 --> 01:20:40,230
and off they go and yeah it happens to

1967
01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:42,000
me all the time too weirdly enough is

1968
01:20:46,040 --> 01:20:43,770
the more you're in this and the more

1969
01:20:47,690 --> 01:20:46,050
your public profile gets raised people

1970
01:20:49,820 --> 01:20:47,700
will come up to you at parties I had one

1971
01:20:52,160 --> 01:20:49,830
two weeks ago young actress came up to

1972
01:20:54,080 --> 01:20:52,170
me at a party and I was introduced he so

1973
01:20:56,210 --> 01:20:54,090
this is the guy that makes UFO films and

1974
01:20:58,160 --> 01:20:56,220
an hour later she and I had been talking

1975
01:21:01,310 --> 01:20:58,170
about UFOs and abductions and all this

1976
01:21:03,770 --> 01:21:01,320
sort of stuff and it the the ability of

1977
01:21:06,650 --> 01:21:03,780
the UFO phenomenon to survive

1978
01:21:08,090 --> 01:21:06,660
the lunacy that is ufology never ceases

1979
01:21:11,090 --> 01:21:08,100
to amaze me that people are so

1980
01:21:12,530 --> 01:21:11,100
interesting really yeah speaking of

1981
01:21:13,970 --> 01:21:12,540
something that's happening ladies and

1982
01:21:15,830 --> 01:21:13,980
gentlemen and others one of the

1983
01:21:19,340 --> 01:21:15,840
documentaries you did Michael what's the

1984
01:21:22,790 --> 01:21:19,350
shag harbour UFO incident yes now that

1985
01:21:24,490 --> 01:21:22,800
sounds fascinating tell us more in 1967

1986
01:21:28,340 --> 01:21:24,500
in the southwestern tip of Nova Scotia

1987
01:21:30,740 --> 01:21:28,350
which to all you wonderful Americans

1988
01:21:39,110 --> 01:21:30,750
down there which is a go to Maine and

1989
01:21:41,600 --> 01:21:39,120
take it right it used to be just okay

1990
01:21:43,580 --> 01:21:41,610
forget anyways the TV show you know the

1991
01:21:44,900 --> 01:21:43,590
guy the funny guy Jon Stewart he used to

1992
01:21:46,760 --> 01:21:44,910
actually his hand used to be just

1993
01:21:48,080 --> 01:21:46,770
underneath Melvin Scotia but it's not

1994
01:21:51,260 --> 01:21:48,090
anymore anyway

1995
01:21:53,240 --> 01:21:51,270
in southwestern tip in the 1967 they

1996
01:21:56,420 --> 01:21:53,250
were UFO sightings all across North

1997
01:21:58,550 --> 01:21:56,430
America United States Northwest Canada

1998
01:22:00,320 --> 01:21:58,560
there were pilots reporting lights in

1999
01:22:02,479 --> 01:22:00,330
the sky there were fishermen we were

2000
01:22:06,550 --> 01:22:02,489
reporting lights in the sky across each

2001
01:22:10,550 --> 01:22:06,560
other to to their shortwave radios and

2002
01:22:14,000 --> 01:22:10,560
VHF radios and in shag harbour Nova

2003
01:22:17,690 --> 01:22:14,010
Scotia this UFO descends and is seen by

2004
01:22:20,120 --> 01:22:17,700
four people minimum descending into and

2005
01:22:22,540 --> 01:22:20,130
crashing into the water and shag harbour

2006
01:22:24,740 --> 01:22:22,550
floating along and then sinking and

2007
01:22:26,120 --> 01:22:24,750
people thought a plane had landed nobody

2008
01:22:28,880 --> 01:22:26,130
thought anybody go for they thought a

2009
01:22:31,580 --> 01:22:28,890
plane had crashed and so fisherman

2010
01:22:34,850 --> 01:22:31,590
organized and set out with the fishing

2011
01:22:37,370 --> 01:22:34,860
boats and they were too late whatever it

2012
01:22:39,500 --> 01:22:37,380
was it submerged into the sound of shake

2013
01:22:41,600 --> 01:22:39,510
Harbor there were people on shore that

2014
01:22:43,880 --> 01:22:41,610
had watched at the RCMP were there and

2015
01:22:45,500 --> 01:22:43,890
the people out on the boats and all they

2016
01:22:48,500 --> 01:22:45,510
encountered was sort of like a weird

2017
01:22:49,939 --> 01:22:48,510
sort of golden foam that they've never

2018
01:22:52,819 --> 01:22:49,949
seen before the fisherman

2019
01:22:54,739 --> 01:22:52,829
in the documentary and a conversation

2020
01:22:56,959 --> 01:22:54,749
that never seen anything like it before

2021
01:22:59,419 --> 01:22:56,969
the DMV search the clerk in the national

2022
01:23:01,790 --> 01:22:59,429
defense searched for several days and

2023
01:23:03,859 --> 01:23:01,800
the brought out some people Sullivan

2024
01:23:06,589 --> 01:23:03,869
would bring out some questionable stuff

2025
01:23:09,290 --> 01:23:06,599
and that was sort of the end of it the

2026
01:23:11,540 --> 01:23:09,300
military admitted that was a UFO in

2027
01:23:13,609 --> 01:23:11,550
their documents under under the fight

2028
01:23:16,429 --> 01:23:13,619
flying object the interesting thing is

2029
01:23:18,290 --> 01:23:16,439
that there was a UFO flap in 1967 all

2030
01:23:20,689 --> 01:23:18,300
across North America and in particular

2031
01:23:22,399 --> 01:23:20,699
in the fall of that year and October 4th

2032
01:23:24,830 --> 01:23:22,409
versus way didn't it smack in the middle

2033
01:23:28,219 --> 01:23:24,840
of that there's the second story in the

2034
01:23:31,159 --> 01:23:28,229
second story is 30 nautical miles up the

2035
01:23:34,159 --> 01:23:31,169
coast east in place called Shelburne

2036
01:23:36,350 --> 01:23:34,169
which was a joint us-canadian top-secret

2037
01:23:39,339 --> 01:23:36,360
military Listening Post for submarines

2038
01:23:41,270 --> 01:23:39,349
to get the submarines crew profiles

2039
01:23:43,310 --> 01:23:41,280
information that was collected to

2040
01:23:45,500 --> 01:23:43,320
identify individual Russian submarines

2041
01:23:48,529 --> 01:23:45,510
and they used what's called the Soo

2042
01:23:52,489 --> 01:23:48,539
sauce net which is under underwater

2043
01:23:54,889 --> 01:23:52,499
sano type of transponder devices they

2044
01:23:56,839 --> 01:23:54,899
can find a receiver that flexes that

2045
01:23:58,669 --> 01:23:56,849
data and it went into a head end at

2046
01:24:00,799 --> 01:23:58,679
Shelburne so there was Americans at

2047
01:24:02,779 --> 01:24:00,809
Canadians working at the space there was

2048
01:24:05,179 --> 01:24:02,789
some boat activity going on there

2049
01:24:06,949 --> 01:24:05,189
normally but all that information was

2050
01:24:09,739 --> 01:24:06,959
collected there is a sensitive place

2051
01:24:11,689 --> 01:24:09,749
from a military point of view as to key

2052
01:24:14,060 --> 01:24:11,699
strategic point of view in the Cold War

2053
01:24:16,399 --> 01:24:14,070
though one of those highly sensitive

2054
01:24:20,750 --> 01:24:16,409
areas like when for example Roswell New

2055
01:24:23,779 --> 01:24:20,760
Mexico with the bombers flooding and so

2056
01:24:25,909 --> 01:24:23,789
the other story is that and I'll just

2057
01:24:27,949 --> 01:24:25,919
tell the story as it was told was that

2058
01:24:30,439 --> 01:24:27,959
this device could potentially have

2059
01:24:33,229 --> 01:24:30,449
actually yes crash to the Chiang Harbor

2060
01:24:36,169 --> 01:24:33,239
and then limped up the coast 32 nautical

2061
01:24:38,239 --> 01:24:36,179
miles the rest off government point

2062
01:24:40,759 --> 01:24:38,249
which is where Canadian Forces station

2063
01:24:43,699 --> 01:24:40,769
shell ver and join us Canadian base was

2064
01:24:48,049 --> 01:24:43,709
located and that they were attended to

2065
01:24:50,149 --> 01:24:48,059
by Canadian and US warships

2066
01:24:53,259 --> 01:24:50,159
while a second craft showed up

2067
01:24:55,429 --> 01:24:53,269
underwater that beings were seen

2068
01:24:57,020 --> 01:24:55,439
surrounding both the crafts and some

2069
01:24:59,600 --> 01:24:57,030
sort of repair operation was taking

2070
01:25:02,719 --> 01:24:59,610
place then a lot of film footage was

2071
01:25:03,529 --> 01:25:02,729
taken that many divers had seen there

2072
01:25:07,250 --> 01:25:03,539
were great

2073
01:25:09,259 --> 01:25:07,260
being flown regularly by Royal Canadian

2074
01:25:10,640 --> 01:25:09,269
Air Force reconnaissance planes at the

2075
01:25:13,040 --> 01:25:10,650
same time a lot of military people

2076
01:25:14,750 --> 01:25:13,050
involved is a debriefing the project

2077
01:25:16,370 --> 01:25:14,760
moonbow mentioned in the United States

2078
01:25:18,020 --> 01:25:16,380
where maybe that they can be United

2079
01:25:21,379 --> 01:25:18,030
States and disease there were sightings

2080
01:25:23,450 --> 01:25:21,389
of alien creatures on land there were

2081
01:25:26,959 --> 01:25:23,460
photographs taken of lights of the night

2082
01:25:32,060 --> 01:25:26,969
of October 4 67 documented photographs a

2083
01:25:35,270 --> 01:25:32,070
lot of government paperwork traffic you

2084
01:25:37,970 --> 01:25:35,280
know was a big event Roswell where

2085
01:25:40,490 --> 01:25:37,980
bigger huh yeah the nice thing about Sag

2086
01:25:44,060 --> 01:25:40,500
Harbor is as opposed to Roswell it took

2087
01:25:45,560 --> 01:25:44,070
place 20 years after Roswell so when the

2088
01:25:48,140 --> 01:25:45,570
investigation is taking place you're a

2089
01:25:50,240 --> 01:25:48,150
little closer in time to when it

2090
01:25:53,990 --> 01:25:50,250
actually occurred there's also as Mike

2091
01:25:56,180 --> 01:25:54,000
mentioned a much more voluminous paper

2092
01:25:58,729 --> 01:25:56,190
trail official paper trail that can be

2093
01:26:01,310 --> 01:25:58,739
documented with shag harbour there's

2094
01:26:04,939 --> 01:26:01,320
there's no question about the witnesses

2095
01:26:06,740 --> 01:26:04,949
the that actually saw the UFO in the sky

2096
01:26:08,450 --> 01:26:06,750
not we're not talking about one or two

2097
01:26:11,149 --> 01:26:08,460
people who claim to recovered records

2098
01:26:12,859 --> 01:26:11,159
you know multiple independent witnesses

2099
01:26:14,899 --> 01:26:12,869
who could all corroborate what the other

2100
01:26:16,250 --> 01:26:14,909
people were saying about what they saw

2101
01:26:18,319 --> 01:26:16,260
in the sky and what happened when it

2102
01:26:22,160 --> 01:26:18,329
went down into the harbor including as I

2103
01:26:24,620 --> 01:26:22,170
recall Mike our CMP officers witnesses

2104
01:26:26,600 --> 01:26:24,630
so I've written about whether or not

2105
01:26:29,240 --> 01:26:26,610
police officers make better witnesses

2106
01:26:31,970 --> 01:26:29,250
but and I don't think they do inherently

2107
01:26:34,879 --> 01:26:31,980
but I also believe that police officers

2108
01:26:36,799 --> 01:26:34,889
are generally honest people who will at

2109
01:26:40,100 --> 01:26:36,809
least honestly report what it is they

2110
01:26:42,049 --> 01:26:40,110
think they're seeing yeah and then

2111
01:26:44,060 --> 01:26:42,059
you've got as Don led you will say one

2112
01:26:46,490 --> 01:26:44,070
of the weirdest things in UFO history

2113
01:26:48,649 --> 01:26:46,500
usually what happens is the witnesses

2114
01:26:50,660 --> 01:26:48,659
will describe what they see as a UFO and

2115
01:26:53,180 --> 01:26:50,670
the government agencies will come in and

2116
01:26:55,100 --> 01:26:53,190
offer an explanation which is in fact

2117
01:26:56,959 --> 01:26:55,110
what happened at Roswell they witnesses

2118
01:26:59,330 --> 01:26:56,969
say we you know we think we got an alien

2119
01:27:01,009 --> 01:26:59,340
spacecraft maybe and the government says

2120
01:27:02,660 --> 01:27:01,019
well not with something else in shag

2121
01:27:04,609 --> 01:27:02,670
harbour it's the exact opposite

2122
01:27:06,740 --> 01:27:04,619
most of the witnesses thought they were

2123
01:27:08,899 --> 01:27:06,750
seeing some sort of crash of an airplane

2124
01:27:10,759 --> 01:27:08,909
in fact as I as I recall that's how it

2125
01:27:13,279 --> 01:27:10,769
was first reported that a plane had

2126
01:27:14,870 --> 01:27:13,289
crashed in the harbor actually though it

2127
01:27:16,490 --> 01:27:14,880
wasn't perfect for that way because it

2128
01:27:17,240 --> 01:27:16,500
wasn't reported to the next day the

2129
01:27:20,030 --> 01:27:17,250
first report

2130
01:27:22,010 --> 01:27:20,040
is something concrete shag harbour and

2131
01:27:24,350 --> 01:27:22,020
it was really but the fact that

2132
01:27:27,700 --> 01:27:24,360
they had already concluded it was in the

2133
01:27:31,700 --> 01:27:27,710
earth plane so the first the first

2134
01:27:35,540 --> 01:27:31,710
release was actually quoting the DND as

2135
01:27:36,920 --> 01:27:35,550
saying that it was no exactly that's the

2136
01:27:39,020 --> 01:27:36,930
point I'm trying to make the witnesses

2137
01:27:41,300 --> 01:27:39,030
themselves when they first reported it

2138
01:27:42,830 --> 01:27:41,310
and I'm pretty sure this was in my film

2139
01:27:44,570 --> 01:27:42,840
best evidence because shag was one of

2140
01:27:45,650 --> 01:27:44,580
the ten best cases and we had done

2141
01:27:47,870 --> 01:27:45,660
talking about it

2142
01:27:49,430 --> 01:27:47,880
the witnesses reported it as they

2143
01:27:52,040 --> 01:27:49,440
thought it was an aircraft it was the

2144
01:27:53,690 --> 01:27:52,050
government and this is this is this rare

2145
01:27:55,130 --> 01:27:53,700
thing it was the military in the

2146
01:27:58,010 --> 01:27:55,140
government that actually characterized

2147
01:27:59,570 --> 01:27:58,020
it as a UFO which is which is kind of

2148
01:28:02,330 --> 01:27:59,580
counterintuitive to how things usually

2149
01:28:03,860 --> 01:28:02,340
roll in these cases well lately and

2150
01:28:10,040 --> 01:28:03,870
Roswell the first press release was

2151
01:28:12,830 --> 01:28:10,050
actually it's a UFO in a sense that's

2152
01:28:14,270 --> 01:28:12,840
the witnesses and in the case you know

2153
01:28:16,490 --> 01:28:14,280
Walter Haught putting out a press

2154
01:28:18,260 --> 01:28:16,500
release saying it's UFO but it's not the

2155
01:28:20,090 --> 01:28:18,270
official government response whereas the

2156
01:28:22,190 --> 01:28:20,100
official government response at shag as

2157
01:28:24,410 --> 01:28:22,200
seen in the documents was very clearly

2158
01:28:27,620 --> 01:28:24,420
you know this is unidentified flying

2159
01:28:30,650 --> 01:28:27,630
object and Canada has a has actually a

2160
01:28:33,220 --> 01:28:30,660
corollary to that with Wilbur Smith when

2161
01:28:36,680 --> 01:28:33,230
Robert Smith had is the UFO research

2162
01:28:39,200 --> 01:28:36,690
detection station just west of Ottawa

2163
01:28:42,140 --> 01:28:39,210
and the detection instruments including

2164
01:28:46,100 --> 01:28:42,150
magnetic anomaly and field disruption

2165
01:28:48,500 --> 01:28:46,110
and all the radio radio receivers were

2166
01:28:50,120 --> 01:28:48,510
tripped unequivocally and their mind

2167
01:28:52,070 --> 01:28:50,130
states that something very unusual had

2168
01:28:55,700 --> 01:28:52,080
passed overhead they released and press

2169
01:28:57,050 --> 01:28:55,710
release to in the same manner and ha you

2170
01:29:00,050 --> 01:28:57,060
know when I was going through through

2171
01:29:01,490 --> 01:29:00,060
channels saying detective you opposed

2172
01:29:03,140 --> 01:29:01,500
you remember that yeah well I don't

2173
01:29:05,540 --> 01:29:03,150
remember personally but ya know I've

2174
01:29:07,340 --> 01:29:05,550
done a little research no no I was there

2175
01:29:10,610 --> 01:29:07,350
was the previous I was Lauren Bacall in

2176
01:29:16,459 --> 01:29:13,030
[Music]

2177
01:29:19,010 --> 01:29:16,469
for 58 years fate has provided true

2178
01:29:21,410 --> 01:29:19,020
reports of the strange and unknown fate

2179
01:29:23,240 --> 01:29:21,420
brings you the latest in all aspects of

2180
01:29:26,810 --> 01:29:23,250
the paranormal like angels and miracles

2181
01:29:29,390 --> 01:29:26,820
psychic phenomena ghosts UFOs and much

2182
01:29:32,150 --> 01:29:29,400
much more to receive your complimentary

2183
01:29:35,720 --> 01:29:32,160
fate magazine call now at one eight

2184
01:29:39,140 --> 01:29:35,730
hundred seven two eight two seven three

2185
01:29:42,080 --> 01:29:39,150
oh or visit their website at WWF eight

2186
01:29:47,950 --> 01:29:42,090
mag calm that's one eight hundred seven

2187
01:29:51,560 --> 01:29:47,960
two eight two seven three zero or WWF a

2188
01:29:59,390 --> 01:29:51,570
TEM AG calm what are you waiting for

2189
01:30:05,459 --> 01:29:59,400
your fate awaits you never know what's

2190
01:30:10,540 --> 01:30:07,929
regardless of who Paul Kimball was in

2191
01:30:12,250 --> 01:30:10,550
the previous life now here's the co-host

2192
01:30:13,810 --> 01:30:12,260
of this episode of the podcast were

2193
01:30:16,419 --> 01:30:13,820
featuring Michael McDonald and we're

2194
01:30:18,729 --> 01:30:16,429
calling me shag harbour UFO incident and

2195
01:30:21,310 --> 01:30:18,739
these two gentlemen both agree this case

2196
01:30:23,319 --> 01:30:21,320
has more compelling evidence than

2197
01:30:25,929 --> 01:30:23,329
Roswell now what does the Canadian

2198
01:30:28,629 --> 01:30:25,939
government say today about this case

2199
01:30:30,279 --> 01:30:28,639
well I'd like to just speak up right

2200
01:30:33,489 --> 01:30:30,289
here because I've been talking to Chris

2201
01:30:35,290 --> 01:30:33,499
Stiles who is the original investigator

2202
01:30:37,509 --> 01:30:35,300
you know along with Don ledger but

2203
01:30:39,520 --> 01:30:37,519
primarily Chris it's done the bulldog

2204
01:30:42,069 --> 01:30:39,530
work of trying to figure out Jay ever

2205
01:30:43,919 --> 01:30:42,079
and continues to do so and Chris even in

2206
01:30:47,589 --> 01:30:43,929
the last couple of years of had

2207
01:30:51,160 --> 01:30:47,599
discussions with with pilots who had

2208
01:30:52,929 --> 01:30:51,170
witnessed UFOs at night he's had a lot

2209
01:30:55,629 --> 01:30:52,939
of corroborating information happen with

2210
01:30:58,089 --> 01:30:55,639
regards to the lighthouse and the logs

2211
01:31:00,250 --> 01:30:58,099
of the Coast Guard which may have been

2212
01:31:02,679 --> 01:31:00,260
altered a lot of weirdness has gone on

2213
01:31:04,689 --> 01:31:02,689
and a lot of corroboration the continual

2214
01:31:07,149 --> 01:31:04,699
corroboration of her earlier testimony

2215
01:31:09,520 --> 01:31:07,159
and evidence still stands up and like

2216
01:31:11,560 --> 01:31:09,530
Chris said back in you know 2001 we did

2217
01:31:14,859 --> 01:31:11,570
that documentary that you know it

2218
01:31:17,290 --> 01:31:14,869
continues to new information continues

2219
01:31:19,239 --> 01:31:17,300
to come out and the story just gets you

2220
01:31:21,759 --> 01:31:19,249
know stronger and stronger and here

2221
01:31:23,709 --> 01:31:21,769
there's 2010 and in the last two years

2222
01:31:26,729 --> 01:31:23,719
you know he's talked to young people you

2223
01:31:29,169 --> 01:31:26,739
know people who were flying in American

2224
01:31:30,580 --> 01:31:29,179
transport machines that night over the

2225
01:31:33,669 --> 01:31:30,590
Gulf of Maine you had Close Encounters

2226
01:31:35,969 --> 01:31:33,679
of UFOs they correlated in time you know

2227
01:31:38,410 --> 01:31:35,979
obviously that night of October 4th 1967

2228
01:31:40,239 --> 01:31:38,420
so this story keeps on going

2229
01:31:41,709 --> 01:31:40,249
you know Roswell hasn't had any new

2230
01:31:43,719 --> 01:31:41,719
information come up other than new

2231
01:31:46,270 --> 01:31:43,729
theories god knows how long

2232
01:31:47,919 --> 01:31:46,280
yeah and I think that's the 20-year time

2233
01:31:49,600 --> 01:31:47,929
lag between the two cases the

2234
01:31:51,790 --> 01:31:49,610
information whether you believe it or

2235
01:31:53,890 --> 01:31:51,800
not for Roswell was going to be coming

2236
01:31:56,140 --> 01:31:53,900
out of the nineteen the 70s in the early

2237
01:31:57,759 --> 01:31:56,150
1980s and then after that if you if

2238
01:31:59,949 --> 01:31:57,769
you're a witness to Roswell and you

2239
01:32:01,779 --> 01:31:59,959
haven't surfaced by 1990 with all the

2240
01:32:04,179 --> 01:32:01,789
media attention it said you're probably

2241
01:32:05,919 --> 01:32:04,189
not gonna surface I am willing to make

2242
01:32:07,660 --> 01:32:05,929
I'm willing to make an exception for one

2243
01:32:10,209 --> 01:32:07,670
or two people it might be very very shy

2244
01:32:12,549 --> 01:32:10,219
but by and large you're probably gonna

2245
01:32:14,439 --> 01:32:12,559
have all the at least witness testimony

2246
01:32:15,969 --> 01:32:14,449
out there and anybody would wonder and

2247
01:32:17,000 --> 01:32:15,979
after that you'd have to be pretty

2248
01:32:19,520 --> 01:32:17,010
suspect

2249
01:32:21,800 --> 01:32:19,530
with shag the story really only broke

2250
01:32:23,540 --> 01:32:21,810
when Don and Chris you know again

2251
01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:23,550
resurfaced when they wrote the book and

2252
01:32:27,350 --> 01:32:25,770
you put your film out and we're dealing

2253
01:32:30,110 --> 01:32:27,360
with sort of the first still the first

2254
01:32:32,150 --> 01:32:30,120
10 or 11 years of the investigation of

2255
01:32:33,860 --> 01:32:32,160
shag and a lot of the people that would

2256
01:32:36,920 --> 01:32:33,870
have been involved would they be older

2257
01:32:40,160 --> 01:32:36,930
now in their 60s maybe 70s but there's

2258
01:32:41,930 --> 01:32:40,170
some people yeah the thing that I don't

2259
01:32:44,570 --> 01:32:41,940
think you mentioned Mike then if you did

2260
01:32:47,060 --> 01:32:44,580
I missed it it wasn't just shag Harbor

2261
01:32:48,890 --> 01:32:47,070
he was cited something was cited flying

2262
01:32:52,100 --> 01:32:48,900
over by an awful lot of people Halifax

2263
01:32:54,830 --> 01:32:52,110
where Stiles it was 13 years old and

2264
01:32:57,110 --> 01:32:54,840
that night he had an extreme close

2265
01:32:59,120 --> 01:32:57,120
encounter with the UFO down at the

2266
01:33:02,480 --> 01:32:59,130
Dartmouth waterfront the same night and

2267
01:33:04,460 --> 01:33:02,490
that's what obviously motivated him gone

2268
01:33:06,590 --> 01:33:04,470
ledger head I think wasn't that night

2269
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:06,600
but within that week he was selling

2270
01:33:10,250 --> 01:33:08,010
musical instruments and on the road

2271
01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:10,260
these are the so surely an experience

2272
01:33:15,350 --> 01:33:11,970
too so both those guys had personal

2273
01:33:18,580 --> 01:33:15,360
experiences from 67 oh yeah one of my

2274
01:33:21,710 --> 01:33:18,590
best friends is he's I think he's 51 and

2275
01:33:24,260 --> 01:33:21,720
he as he as a kid he remembers seeing it

2276
01:33:26,150 --> 01:33:24,270
because he lived here in Halifax knee he

2277
01:33:29,420 --> 01:33:26,160
remembers it clear as a day he tells me

2278
01:33:30,860 --> 01:33:29,430
all these years later seeing a UFO fly

2279
01:33:33,140 --> 01:33:30,870
over Halifax and it you know eventually

2280
01:33:34,610 --> 01:33:33,150
on its way down to Shelburne Sag Harbor

2281
01:33:36,410 --> 01:33:34,620
which is about you know if you have to

2282
01:33:39,320 --> 01:33:36,420
drive two and a half hours from Halifax

2283
01:33:41,030 --> 01:33:39,330
so whatever was it was not only sighted

2284
01:33:42,470 --> 01:33:41,040
that's part of the story that's often

2285
01:33:44,690 --> 01:33:42,480
missed it wasn't just sighted in Sag

2286
01:33:46,790 --> 01:33:44,700
Harbor it was sighted in other areas of

2287
01:33:48,680 --> 01:33:46,800
the province before it hit shag harbour

2288
01:33:51,200 --> 01:33:48,690
and for Americans that would be kind of

2289
01:33:53,360 --> 01:33:51,210
be like to use Roswell as an example

2290
01:33:55,970 --> 01:33:53,370
people in Albuquerque seeing something

2291
01:33:58,310 --> 01:33:55,980
that then is seen or crashes in Roswell

2292
01:34:00,620 --> 01:33:58,320
you know two and a half hours later way

2293
01:34:02,270 --> 01:34:00,630
by Road so that's the kind of distance

2294
01:34:04,580 --> 01:34:02,280
you're dealing with yeah it just didn't

2295
01:34:06,890 --> 01:34:04,590
pop in it flew you know thrown yeah

2296
01:34:09,290 --> 01:34:06,900
there were sightings all the way from

2297
01:34:11,840 --> 01:34:09,300
Northwest Territories all through

2298
01:34:14,330 --> 01:34:11,850
central Canada and Eastern Canada and

2299
01:34:17,030 --> 01:34:14,340
the Maritimes by pilots and other

2300
01:34:19,400 --> 01:34:17,040
individuals and and that night there was

2301
01:34:21,290 --> 01:34:19,410
a flurry of lights and UFO activities

2302
01:34:24,860 --> 01:34:21,300
all the way from Gatineau Nova Scotia

2303
01:34:27,680 --> 01:34:24,870
but the north western tip Digby neck and

2304
01:34:29,800 --> 01:34:27,690
then down shell burned and then you know

2305
01:34:31,630 --> 01:34:29,810
there's a photograph that was taken in

2306
01:34:33,400 --> 01:34:31,640
bird by a photographer was taking

2307
01:34:35,110 --> 01:34:33,410
picture of an old both of you burning

2308
01:34:37,030 --> 01:34:35,120
and it's a beautiful photograph it's

2309
01:34:38,740 --> 01:34:37,040
just beautiful I mean it's a time-lapse

2310
01:34:40,780 --> 01:34:38,750
it's five minutes so you see the stars

2311
01:34:43,870 --> 01:34:40,790
are all streak the UFOs are in

2312
01:34:46,390 --> 01:34:43,880
geosynchronous exact precise position

2313
01:34:50,740 --> 01:34:46,400
three of them yeah and it's the NVIDIA

2314
01:34:52,540 --> 01:34:50,750
pennant stayed geosynchronous the

2315
01:34:56,020 --> 01:34:52,550
interesting thing comparing again shag

2316
01:34:57,130 --> 01:34:56,030
to Roswell is as far as I know and

2317
01:35:00,220 --> 01:34:57,140
correct me if I'm wrong

2318
01:35:02,650 --> 01:35:00,230
Mike the government has never offered a

2319
01:35:05,470 --> 01:35:02,660
definitive explanation for what happened

2320
01:35:07,180 --> 01:35:05,480
at shag whereas with Roswell whether you

2321
01:35:09,640 --> 01:35:07,190
believe it or not the government has

2322
01:35:11,530 --> 01:35:09,650
trotted out a very large report saying

2323
01:35:13,270 --> 01:35:11,540
well it was project mogul and here's all

2324
01:35:14,440 --> 01:35:13,280
the evidence we have so at least you

2325
01:35:18,130 --> 01:35:14,450
know the government took a position on

2326
01:35:20,200 --> 01:35:18,140
that in Canada 43 years later because I

2327
01:35:23,320 --> 01:35:20,210
was born in 67 I know exactly what that

2328
01:35:25,030 --> 01:35:23,330
number is sadly 43 years later there's

2329
01:35:30,400 --> 01:35:25,040
never been an official explanation as

2330
01:35:32,740 --> 01:35:30,410
far as I know they sorry that will be

2331
01:35:35,830 --> 01:35:32,750
lost on anyone who is not a Canadian but

2332
01:35:37,750 --> 01:35:35,840
that's that's when our prime minister

2333
01:35:40,240 --> 01:35:37,760
can basically suspend democracy in

2334
01:35:47,170 --> 01:35:40,250
Canada which he does it's also a nice

2335
01:35:49,420 --> 01:35:47,180
light snack only in Canada pity yes

2336
01:35:51,160 --> 01:35:49,430
we're hearing some Canadian jokes here

2337
01:35:52,420 --> 01:35:51,170
ladies and gentlemen I do not understand

2338
01:35:54,430 --> 01:35:52,430
anything they're saying they could be

2339
01:35:58,300 --> 01:35:54,440
doing all sorts of weird stuff and I

2340
01:36:00,100 --> 01:35:58,310
have no clue but the point is Jean every

2341
01:36:01,870 --> 01:36:00,110
Canadian almost every Canadian lives

2342
01:36:04,600 --> 01:36:01,880
eventually in Arizona you must know

2343
01:36:06,220 --> 01:36:04,610
millions of them I do yeah all the

2344
01:36:08,590 --> 01:36:06,230
snowbirds they get out when they retain

2345
01:36:11,350 --> 01:36:08,600
the Canadian you should check yeah I

2346
01:36:12,370 --> 01:36:11,360
mean the Arizona is the 11th Canadian

2347
01:36:15,220 --> 01:36:12,380
province as far as we're concerned

2348
01:36:16,720 --> 01:36:15,230
that's where they all go so why aren't

2349
01:36:18,430 --> 01:36:16,730
you down here and we're doing the show

2350
01:36:19,990 --> 01:36:18,440
live and you're sitting across from me

2351
01:36:21,940 --> 01:36:20,000
why aren't you sitting across from me I

2352
01:36:23,620 --> 01:36:21,950
wish I was because then I'd be in

2353
01:36:26,080 --> 01:36:23,630
Arizona where it's presumably a lot

2354
01:36:28,450 --> 01:36:26,090
warmer than it is Nell effects today but

2355
01:36:31,630 --> 01:36:28,460
I'm just raining today in Arizona and

2356
01:36:33,370 --> 01:36:31,640
the temperature was in the 50s well the

2357
01:36:36,850 --> 01:36:33,380
temperature was in the 30s here today so

2358
01:36:39,130 --> 01:36:36,860
there you go highway yes yes you do

2359
01:36:41,310 --> 01:36:39,140
except we didn't have the rain but I

2360
01:36:43,800 --> 01:36:41,320
think it's important

2361
01:36:45,810 --> 01:36:43,810
case my final word on this I don't want

2362
01:36:49,109 --> 01:36:45,820
to ramble on but I think it is there's

2363
01:36:51,600 --> 01:36:49,119
an American sort of centric viewpoint

2364
01:36:53,910 --> 01:36:51,610
particularly amongst Americans when it

2365
01:36:56,010 --> 01:36:53,920
comes to the UFO phenomenon so Roswell

2366
01:36:57,899 --> 01:36:56,020
is such a big case even though all of

2367
01:37:00,180 --> 01:36:57,909
the elements in Roswell pretty much

2368
01:37:03,419 --> 01:37:00,190
exists in shag only better I think and

2369
01:37:05,160 --> 01:37:03,429
you know shag is largely unknown outside

2370
01:37:07,200 --> 01:37:05,170
of Canada and I would suggest even

2371
01:37:09,330 --> 01:37:07,210
within candidates it's not as well-known

2372
01:37:11,189 --> 01:37:09,340
as it could be and that's the case I

2373
01:37:14,129 --> 01:37:11,199
think with a lot of really good UFO

2374
01:37:17,910 --> 01:37:14,139
cases the 1976 Iranian jet fighter case

2375
01:37:21,720 --> 01:37:17,920
in in Iran again largely unknown outside

2376
01:37:22,979 --> 01:37:21,730
of the sort of core UFO field because

2377
01:37:26,729 --> 01:37:22,989
people are so busy talking about

2378
01:37:28,859 --> 01:37:26,739
Kecksburg or Roswell or god forbid Aztec

2379
01:37:31,800 --> 01:37:28,869
but all of them being cases that took

2380
01:37:33,359 --> 01:37:31,810
place where in the United States and I

2381
01:37:35,160 --> 01:37:33,369
think that's that's a shame because it

2382
01:37:37,140 --> 01:37:35,170
sort of puts this veneer of well it's

2383
01:37:38,490 --> 01:37:37,150
just an American thing right and the

2384
01:37:40,530 --> 01:37:38,500
rest of the world then says well it's

2385
01:37:42,450 --> 01:37:40,540
just those crazy Americans whereas in

2386
01:37:45,540 --> 01:37:42,460
the truth it's a it's a worldwide

2387
01:37:47,040 --> 01:37:45,550
phenomenon happening everywhere and I

2388
01:37:48,859 --> 01:37:47,050
think it's important to never lose sight

2389
01:37:51,180 --> 01:37:48,869
of that in cases like shag harbour and

2390
01:37:53,850 --> 01:37:51,190
filmmakers like Mike making films about

2391
01:37:55,589 --> 01:37:53,860
cases like shag harbour remind us of

2392
01:37:57,720 --> 01:37:55,599
that and I think that's very important

2393
01:38:01,350 --> 01:37:57,730
Mike was this film shown in the United

2394
01:38:04,169 --> 01:38:01,360
States no actually my first broadcaster

2395
01:38:07,919 --> 01:38:04,179
was space network in Canada and then

2396
01:38:10,770 --> 01:38:07,929
they got then we sold it to discovery UK

2397
01:38:13,020 --> 01:38:10,780
now discovery UK is not just the United

2398
01:38:15,419 --> 01:38:13,030
Kingdom so then they did a you know

2399
01:38:19,109 --> 01:38:15,429
Eastern European translations of it so

2400
01:38:21,120 --> 01:38:19,119
Europe the United Kingdom and Canada but

2401
01:38:23,520 --> 01:38:21,130
not the United States so I guess we're

2402
01:38:25,439 --> 01:38:23,530
not helping I'm not helping I'm helping

2403
01:38:26,819 --> 01:38:25,449
because you're on the show and even

2404
01:38:28,200 --> 01:38:26,829
though we originated in America we have

2405
01:38:29,490 --> 01:38:28,210
a worldwide audience and one of the

2406
01:38:32,430 --> 01:38:29,500
things we've tried to do in the power

2407
01:38:34,319 --> 01:38:32,440
cast is to emphasize the fact that the

2408
01:38:35,910 --> 01:38:34,329
UFO phenomenon and as a matter of fact

2409
01:38:37,740 --> 01:38:35,920
all the paranormal things that we cover

2410
01:38:40,530 --> 01:38:37,750
happen around the world and certainly

2411
01:38:42,510 --> 01:38:40,540
Paul kept alive because we were talking

2412
01:38:44,550 --> 01:38:42,520
to guests on a previous session from the

2413
01:38:46,800 --> 01:38:44,560
UK we've just had a session with

2414
01:38:48,750 --> 01:38:46,810
Christopher O'Brien on animal

2415
01:38:51,660 --> 01:38:48,760
mutilations where one of our guests was

2416
01:38:53,490 --> 01:38:51,670
a uk-based researcher we've talked to AJ

2417
01:38:53,820 --> 01:38:53,500
curve aired in Brazil we've talked to

2418
01:38:55,680 --> 01:38:53,830
every

2419
01:38:58,200 --> 01:38:55,690
searchers from Australia we're trying to

2420
01:39:00,510 --> 01:38:58,210
emphasize the fact that this happens

2421
01:39:01,920 --> 01:39:00,520
around the world I'll make a pledge I'm

2422
01:39:04,100 --> 01:39:01,930
gonna make a pledge on I'm gonna say it

2423
01:39:07,050 --> 01:39:04,110
out there to the wide public I said

2424
01:39:08,820 --> 01:39:07,060
distribution of small documentary films

2425
01:39:11,160 --> 01:39:08,830
first of all is not an easy thing as

2426
01:39:12,450 --> 01:39:11,170
Paul would definitely say and even when

2427
01:39:14,580 --> 01:39:12,460
you do get a distribution bill the

2428
01:39:17,760 --> 01:39:14,590
actual distribution of the product can

2429
01:39:19,410 --> 01:39:17,770
be you know less than satisfied so what

2430
01:39:21,990 --> 01:39:19,420
I'm going to do is I'm going to take all

2431
01:39:24,780 --> 01:39:22,000
of my UFO films and I'm going to put

2432
01:39:25,950 --> 01:39:24,790
them available for viewing on YouTube

2433
01:39:27,720 --> 01:39:25,960
which means that people have to watch

2434
01:39:30,060 --> 01:39:27,730
them I guess right now in 10 minutes

2435
01:39:30,480 --> 01:39:30,070
chunks and so that will solve the

2436
01:39:33,300 --> 01:39:30,490
problem

2437
01:39:38,520 --> 01:39:33,310
you know of getting a hold of watching

2438
01:39:40,650 --> 01:39:38,530
you know the shaky distribution no you

2439
01:39:43,140 --> 01:39:40,660
know it just doesn't it's it actually

2440
01:39:45,510 --> 01:39:43,150
cost me more money and it's more of a

2441
01:39:49,200 --> 01:39:45,520
pain in the butt than it's worth at the

2442
01:39:51,840 --> 01:39:49,210
BFI you know it would cost me money to

2443
01:39:53,640 --> 01:39:51,850
do it and people write me and they ask

2444
01:39:55,560 --> 01:39:53,650
for copies of DVDs and I don't even

2445
01:39:57,390 --> 01:39:55,570
charge them I send them copy baby babies

2446
01:39:59,610 --> 01:39:57,400
and I'd rather just sort of put it out

2447
01:40:02,430 --> 01:39:59,620
there I've made my money from from the

2448
01:40:04,680 --> 01:40:02,440
films you know realistically they don't

2449
01:40:05,940 --> 01:40:04,690
bring in that much cash you know Famous

2450
01:40:08,280 --> 01:40:05,950
Monsters a slightly different scenario

2451
01:40:10,170 --> 01:40:08,290
and I have a bona fide distributor

2452
01:40:12,030 --> 01:40:10,180
that's handling you know the European

2453
01:40:13,530 --> 01:40:12,040
sales but in North America is it the hot

2454
01:40:18,570 --> 01:40:13,540
nut and crack but it has the

2455
01:40:20,340 --> 01:40:18,580
distribution yeah the US is a tough

2456
01:40:22,680 --> 01:40:20,350
market to crack for anybody who's not

2457
01:40:24,480 --> 01:40:22,690
from the US you know for a country I

2458
01:40:27,540 --> 01:40:24,490
love America don't get me wrong but for

2459
01:40:28,980 --> 01:40:27,550
a country that seemingly all about free

2460
01:40:31,470 --> 01:40:28,990
trade and you know all that sort of

2461
01:40:32,790 --> 01:40:31,480
stuff it's a very protectionist country

2462
01:40:35,790 --> 01:40:32,800
when it comes to the entertainment

2463
01:40:38,520 --> 01:40:35,800
industry very protectionist in the sense

2464
01:40:40,080 --> 01:40:38,530
that very closed-minded you know if we

2465
01:40:42,150 --> 01:40:40,090
haven't made it we don't necessarily

2466
01:40:43,740 --> 01:40:42,160
want to see it and I think you know

2467
01:40:46,440 --> 01:40:43,750
that's a shame it is Mike's quite right

2468
01:40:49,110 --> 01:40:46,450
it's it's relatively easy to sell our

2469
01:40:51,540 --> 01:40:49,120
films with a good distributor into other

2470
01:40:53,490 --> 01:40:51,550
countries like best evidence aired in

2471
01:40:56,010 --> 01:40:53,500
New Zealand on TV and Zedd for instance

2472
01:40:58,830 --> 01:40:56,020
but getting into the u.s. that's

2473
01:41:01,530 --> 01:40:58,840
difficult and the shame is a lot of

2474
01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:01,540
shows gene like yours and others a lot

2475
01:41:04,590 --> 01:41:03,010
of the listeners are Americans and then

2476
01:41:05,180 --> 01:41:04,600
they somebody just on the pair of cast

2477
01:41:06,800 --> 01:41:05,190
forms

2478
01:41:09,020 --> 01:41:06,810
had this thread about where can i buy

2479
01:41:10,460 --> 01:41:09,030
best evidence and I said well you can't

2480
01:41:12,620 --> 01:41:10,470
even buy it from me I don't even have a

2481
01:41:15,320 --> 01:41:12,630
copy I mean I can take the master and go

2482
01:41:17,210 --> 01:41:15,330
make a DVD for myself but I don't have a

2483
01:41:18,920 --> 01:41:17,220
copy sitting around in the house it's

2484
01:41:22,670 --> 01:41:18,930
it's been going through distribution

2485
01:41:24,860 --> 01:41:22,680
hell so to try and even get it on DVD is

2486
01:41:26,720 --> 01:41:24,870
difficult to get it on television in the

2487
01:41:29,090 --> 01:41:26,730
US all I can say is I would encourage

2488
01:41:30,770 --> 01:41:29,100
your listeners to write and say look

2489
01:41:32,660 --> 01:41:30,780
we'd like to see Mike McDonald shag

2490
01:41:35,150 --> 01:41:32,670
harbour film can you air that on the

2491
01:41:37,310 --> 01:41:35,160
sci-fi channel or on history or whatever

2492
01:41:38,750 --> 01:41:37,320
and if enough people write eventually

2493
01:41:41,030 --> 01:41:38,760
they might take a look at it you know

2494
01:41:43,520 --> 01:41:41,040
what's interesting - yes we don't run

2495
01:41:45,560 --> 01:41:43,530
Canadian product here but tech we make

2496
01:41:48,770 --> 01:41:45,570
films up in Vancouver all the time how

2497
01:41:51,530 --> 01:41:48,780
many films how many major TV shows are

2498
01:41:53,590 --> 01:41:51,540
done in Vancouver what fringe from folks

2499
01:41:56,600 --> 01:41:53,600
I work with all shot in Vancouver

2500
01:41:58,160 --> 01:41:56,610
Battlestar Galactica Stargate most of

2501
01:41:59,180 --> 01:41:58,170
the Stargate shows they're shot in

2502
01:42:02,780 --> 01:41:59,190
Vancouver

2503
01:42:05,950 --> 01:42:02,790
largest production Center in Canada

2504
01:42:08,750 --> 01:42:05,960
Toronto often doubles for Chicago and

2505
01:42:11,150 --> 01:42:08,760
Montreal is a major production center

2506
01:42:12,590 --> 01:42:11,160
for French filmmaking and Halifax is

2507
01:42:15,110 --> 01:42:12,600
actually the fourth largest production

2508
01:42:16,640 --> 01:42:15,120
Center in Canada we do over a hundred

2509
01:42:18,470 --> 01:42:16,650
million dollars worth of business a year

2510
01:42:20,570 --> 01:42:18,480
with television feature films and

2511
01:42:23,030 --> 01:42:20,580
documentaries so there's a lot of stuff

2512
01:42:25,310 --> 01:42:23,040
I mean Mike's a great filmmaker I've

2513
01:42:27,410 --> 01:42:25,320
done good films I think David Cherne act

2514
01:42:31,430 --> 01:42:27,420
was a wonderful Canadian filmmaker

2515
01:42:33,410 --> 01:42:31,440
released whoa it was a two-hour opus on

2516
01:42:35,420 --> 01:42:33,420
basically the history of the UFO

2517
01:42:37,370 --> 01:42:35,430
phenomenon I think it was two years ago

2518
01:42:38,690 --> 01:42:37,380
and I don't know if that's there in the

2519
01:42:40,580 --> 01:42:38,700
United States yet or not but he had

2520
01:42:42,650 --> 01:42:40,590
everyone from Jerry Clark to Stan

2521
01:42:44,720 --> 01:42:42,660
Freedman in his film and there's a

2522
01:42:46,040 --> 01:42:44,730
wonderful film and if you I would say if

2523
01:42:48,200 --> 01:42:46,050
you want to see the one definitive film

2524
01:42:48,470 --> 01:42:48,210
about the UFO phenomenon the history of

2525
01:42:50,900 --> 01:42:48,480
it

2526
01:42:52,580 --> 01:42:50,910
that's the film well I don't know if

2527
01:42:54,500 --> 01:42:52,590
it's ever aired in the United States I

2528
01:43:03,340 --> 01:42:54,510
hope it has but I don't think it has oh

2529
01:43:08,460 --> 01:43:05,820
[Music]

2530
01:43:10,530 --> 01:43:08,470
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2531
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2539
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primary focus because your support means

2542
01:43:34,530 --> 01:43:31,810
so much to us if you'd like to learn

2543
01:43:36,630 --> 01:43:34,540
more please visit us at radio name chief

2544
01:43:38,520 --> 01:43:36,640
comm for web hosting and domain name

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2546
01:43:46,110 --> 01:43:43,930
twitter at twitter.com/zeromd bars on

2547
01:43:47,530 --> 01:43:46,120
facebook at facebook.com slash named

2548
01:43:51,689 --> 01:43:47,540
chief see you online

2549
01:43:54,790 --> 01:43:51,699
[Music]

2550
01:43:56,200 --> 01:43:54,800
you've entered another dimension we've

2551
01:44:10,050 --> 01:43:56,210
entered the merriest

2552
01:44:10,060 --> 01:44:14,600
[Music]

2553
01:44:20,220 --> 01:44:17,550
we have Michael McDonald a Canadian

2554
01:44:22,620 --> 01:44:20,230
filmmaker another Canadian filmmaker is

2555
01:44:24,600 --> 01:44:22,630
our guest co-host Paul Campbell and we

2556
01:44:26,610 --> 01:44:24,610
all want to see their films here I'm so

2557
01:44:28,500 --> 01:44:26,620
curious to see all these films I want to

2558
01:44:30,960 --> 01:44:28,510
see the what about forry ackerman I want

2559
01:44:32,880 --> 01:44:30,970
to see the shag harbour UFO and said I

2560
01:44:34,979 --> 01:44:32,890
want to see best evidence Paul Kimball

2561
01:44:37,260 --> 01:44:34,989
one I want to see here ladies and

2562
01:44:38,880 --> 01:44:37,270
gentlemen we have the power we have a

2563
01:44:41,100 --> 01:44:38,890
pretty big audience on the power cast

2564
01:44:41,520 --> 01:44:41,110
worldwide a lot of people in the United

2565
01:44:45,120 --> 01:44:41,530
States

2566
01:44:47,610 --> 01:44:45,130
contact NBC CBS because NBC owns a

2567
01:44:49,080 --> 01:44:47,620
sci-fi channel contact all these major

2568
01:44:51,000 --> 01:44:49,090
networks because they own the cable

2569
01:44:52,560 --> 01:44:51,010
networks you know it's all concentrated

2570
01:44:54,870 --> 01:44:52,570
a small number of owners on everything

2571
01:44:58,470 --> 01:44:54,880
universe alone side play that's right

2572
01:45:02,310 --> 01:44:58,480
yeah I saw NBC and all that stuff tell

2573
01:45:04,410 --> 01:45:02,320
them hey we want to see these films if

2574
01:45:06,870 --> 01:45:04,420
enough people say we want to see it you

2575
01:45:08,490 --> 01:45:06,880
know they'll go write a check to Michael

2576
01:45:09,780 --> 01:45:08,500
or Paul so they can get the money they

2577
01:45:12,810 --> 01:45:09,790
deserve for all the work they've done

2578
01:45:14,580 --> 01:45:12,820
and the films will be seen and I'm doing

2579
01:45:16,920 --> 01:45:14,590
this unsolicited they didn't ask me to

2580
01:45:20,210 --> 01:45:16,930
do this by the way by the way Michael

2581
01:45:23,070 --> 01:45:20,220
you owe me well we don't go into that

2582
01:45:25,380 --> 01:45:23,080
you can have 20% of whatever we make

2583
01:45:31,620 --> 01:45:25,390
Jean which will be virtually nothing I

2584
01:45:36,540 --> 01:45:31,630
would just be happy no no no no okay

2585
01:45:38,490 --> 01:45:36,550
well that Lemberg has Bobby I'll send

2586
01:45:40,590 --> 01:45:38,500
you a copy of best evidence most of best

2587
01:45:42,570 --> 01:45:40,600
evidence I like Mike I put it up on

2588
01:45:44,010 --> 01:45:42,580
YouTube but you know it's all I think

2589
01:45:45,990 --> 01:45:44,020
it's always best if you see it on

2590
01:45:47,729 --> 01:45:46,000
television which is where it was meant

2591
01:45:50,940 --> 01:45:47,739
to be seen and said of ten minute chunks

2592
01:45:53,280 --> 01:45:50,950
so you can see it as fronts in its

2593
01:45:54,930 --> 01:45:53,290
continuity in context and actually you

2594
01:45:57,390 --> 01:45:54,940
know frankly the pictures better to

2595
01:45:59,550 --> 01:45:57,400
ascertain that could deal with Netflix

2596
01:46:02,520 --> 01:45:59,560
for something like that you can make all

2597
01:46:05,340 --> 01:46:02,530
sorts of deals but these people talk to

2598
01:46:07,680 --> 01:46:05,350
distributors and not filmmakers so it's

2599
01:46:09,270 --> 01:46:07,690
very hard to distribute your film if you

2600
01:46:11,310 --> 01:46:09,280
don't have a distributor now I for all

2601
01:46:13,290 --> 01:46:11,320
of my films I now have distributors so I

2602
01:46:15,270 --> 01:46:13,300
think you'll actually start to see best

2603
01:46:16,590 --> 01:46:15,280
evidence do you some of the other UFO

2604
01:46:19,770 --> 01:46:16,600
films are actually on

2605
01:46:21,240 --> 01:46:19,780
Stan Friedman is real is on YouTube in

2606
01:46:23,850 --> 01:46:21,250
its entirety from start to finish

2607
01:46:25,920 --> 01:46:23,860
because my distributor paranormal media

2608
01:46:27,900 --> 01:46:25,930
put it up there and they make money off

2609
01:46:29,850 --> 01:46:27,910
advertising and stuff like that but

2610
01:46:31,110 --> 01:46:29,860
here's the crazy thing you know we're

2611
01:46:32,850 --> 01:46:31,120
sort of off topic but I think it's

2612
01:46:34,500 --> 01:46:32,860
important for people to realize when

2613
01:46:36,780 --> 01:46:34,510
they put that up there I went on YouTube

2614
01:46:39,510 --> 01:46:36,790
and I took a look and some of the

2615
01:46:41,250 --> 01:46:39,520
comments people were making is well you

2616
01:46:43,170 --> 01:46:41,260
know I don't watch this because there's

2617
01:46:45,420 --> 01:46:43,180
ads on it and I shouldn't have to watch

2618
01:46:47,430 --> 01:46:45,430
ads on YouTube nothing you don't get

2619
01:46:49,380 --> 01:46:47,440
anything for free people I'm sorry

2620
01:46:50,820 --> 01:46:49,390
people have to make money distributors

2621
01:46:52,620 --> 01:46:50,830
have to make money filmmakers have to

2622
01:46:55,650 --> 01:46:52,630
make money which means you might have to

2623
01:46:57,390 --> 01:46:55,660
sit through a few ads advertisements in

2624
01:46:59,340 --> 01:46:57,400
order to watch my film in its entirety

2625
01:47:00,870 --> 01:46:59,350
and I was just gobsmacked when I saw

2626
01:47:02,790 --> 01:47:00,880
that when I saw person after person

2627
01:47:04,800 --> 01:47:02,800
complaining that they had to sit and

2628
01:47:06,810 --> 01:47:04,810
watch ads on YouTube well then don't

2629
01:47:08,670 --> 01:47:06,820
watch the film I would say to them but

2630
01:47:10,350 --> 01:47:08,680
don't ruin it for everybody else then

2631
01:47:12,120 --> 01:47:10,360
there that's my one little filmmaker

2632
01:47:13,020 --> 01:47:12,130
moment where I say you know sometimes

2633
01:47:14,910 --> 01:47:13,030
you get what you deserve

2634
01:47:17,250 --> 01:47:14,920
well I think it's come to the philosophy

2635
01:47:19,260 --> 01:47:17,260
now that we have a DVR and we just

2636
01:47:21,570 --> 01:47:19,270
record the shows and as a matter of fact

2637
01:47:23,370 --> 01:47:21,580
other shows are really good they get a

2638
01:47:25,710 --> 01:47:23,380
lousy rating and then four million

2639
01:47:27,660 --> 01:47:25,720
people are seeing them on a DVR but

2640
01:47:30,300 --> 01:47:27,670
they're skipping past the commercials of

2641
01:47:32,280 --> 01:47:30,310
course I do that too so I can't stand

2642
01:47:33,750 --> 01:47:32,290
these horrible Windows 7 commercials

2643
01:47:36,030 --> 01:47:33,760
from Microsoft that's the point

2644
01:47:37,500 --> 01:47:36,040
I know filmmakers and people in the film

2645
01:47:39,600 --> 01:47:37,510
industry who down I you know they

2646
01:47:40,920 --> 01:47:39,610
battlestar galactica it was an example I

2647
01:47:42,450 --> 01:47:40,930
said how can you watch Battlestar

2648
01:47:43,860 --> 01:47:42,460
Galactica you don't even have cable you

2649
01:47:46,200 --> 01:47:43,870
know we just download it for free off

2650
01:47:47,760 --> 01:47:46,210
the internet I say do you realize what

2651
01:47:50,250 --> 01:47:47,770
you're doing you're putting yourself out

2652
01:47:52,020 --> 01:47:50,260
of business that's crazy but you know

2653
01:47:53,310 --> 01:47:52,030
even filmmakers are doing it everybody

2654
01:47:55,590 --> 01:47:53,320
thinks they can get something for free

2655
01:47:57,090 --> 01:47:55,600
these days and that's a mistake it takes

2656
01:47:59,130 --> 01:47:57,100
money to go out and do what Mike and I

2657
01:48:00,750 --> 01:47:59,140
have done over the years which is make

2658
01:48:02,670 --> 01:48:00,760
films it takes a lot of money doesn't it

2659
01:48:04,980 --> 01:48:02,680
Mike to do it well thanks hundreds of

2660
01:48:06,840 --> 01:48:04,990
thousands of dollars I always get my

2661
01:48:08,340 --> 01:48:06,850
films from the library or from the video

2662
01:48:09,960 --> 01:48:08,350
rental place because I agree with Paul

2663
01:48:12,300 --> 01:48:09,970
you know I don't really appreciate

2664
01:48:13,890 --> 01:48:12,310
having my stuff being you know ripped

2665
01:48:15,870 --> 01:48:13,900
off for me nothing that happens too much

2666
01:48:17,370 --> 01:48:15,880
but that has happened I can see the

2667
01:48:19,800 --> 01:48:17,380
point of view and this how we biggle

2668
01:48:22,050 --> 01:48:19,810
early will tell you this folks now

2669
01:48:24,420 --> 01:48:22,060
everyone knows about my financial woes

2670
01:48:27,960 --> 01:48:24,430
because they've been spread far and wide

2671
01:48:29,160 --> 01:48:27,970
I still managed to pay for my Netflix

2672
01:48:31,620 --> 01:48:29,170
subscription every month

2673
01:48:33,720 --> 01:48:31,630
one of the basic subscriptions so I had

2674
01:48:36,270 --> 01:48:33,730
the DVDs I'm paying the money for it

2675
01:48:38,730 --> 01:48:36,280
I can stream the stuff through Netflix I

2676
01:48:40,500 --> 01:48:38,740
don't believe in getting stuff free that

2677
01:48:42,570 --> 01:48:40,510
way I've never done it even with music

2678
01:48:44,670 --> 01:48:42,580
because I have you know close ties with

2679
01:48:46,410 --> 01:48:44,680
the music industry my wife used to be a

2680
01:48:50,220 --> 01:48:46,420
singer we spend time in the recording

2681
01:48:52,260 --> 01:48:50,230
studio so back to UFOs yes sorry that

2682
01:48:54,480 --> 01:48:52,270
was made the pitch I think it was worth

2683
01:48:56,070 --> 01:48:54,490
it because I care enough about what

2684
01:48:57,210 --> 01:48:56,080
people like you do that I want to see

2685
01:48:58,920 --> 01:48:57,220
you make a buck

2686
01:49:00,600 --> 01:48:58,930
what other documentaries can we mention

2687
01:49:02,760 --> 01:49:00,610
briefly Michael we don't have a lot of

2688
01:49:05,820 --> 01:49:02,770
time that you've done on UFOs

2689
01:49:08,040 --> 01:49:05,830
I see part series called the Northern

2690
01:49:10,380 --> 01:49:08,050
Lights the Canadian UFO experience and

2691
01:49:12,600 --> 01:49:10,390
really what it was about was Canada and

2692
01:49:14,010 --> 01:49:12,610
the United States and the the

2693
01:49:16,050 --> 01:49:14,020
synchronicities that occurred in the

2694
01:49:18,180 --> 01:49:16,060
events that happened where the two came

2695
01:49:20,790 --> 01:49:18,190
together with regards to UFOs didn't

2696
01:49:24,630 --> 01:49:20,800
investigate UFOs so I did that I did

2697
01:49:27,060 --> 01:49:24,640
intruders and I did the chancre where

2698
01:49:28,770 --> 01:49:27,070
UFO incident and that's it for UFOs I

2699
01:49:31,070 --> 01:49:28,780
did what I did one on science fiction

2700
01:49:33,750 --> 01:49:31,080
art and of course the for is J Ackerman

2701
01:49:35,850 --> 01:49:33,760
documentary I'd love to do another UFO

2702
01:49:38,460 --> 01:49:35,860
documentary I don't know what it would

2703
01:49:40,650 --> 01:49:38,470
be and I think it's gonna be some time

2704
01:49:42,690 --> 01:49:40,660
before I put that focus again I need to

2705
01:49:45,930 --> 01:49:42,700
get away from it to be honest I need to

2706
01:49:47,340 --> 01:49:45,940
sort of not think about it so that when

2707
01:49:49,470 --> 01:49:47,350
I do come back to it I'm more

2708
01:49:51,900 --> 01:49:49,480
open-minded and and have a fresher

2709
01:49:53,940 --> 01:49:51,910
experience do you do mainstream films

2710
01:49:56,430 --> 01:49:53,950
such as dramas and stuff or is it all

2711
01:49:59,240 --> 01:49:56,440
documentary I am teaching now I'm

2712
01:50:02,580 --> 01:49:59,250
teaching film at a local college and

2713
01:50:04,080 --> 01:50:02,590
really enjoying that a lot so I've taken

2714
01:50:07,410 --> 01:50:04,090
a break from filmmaking for the last

2715
01:50:10,560 --> 01:50:07,420
seven or eight months and I think I'm

2716
01:50:12,210 --> 01:50:10,570
going to probably you know I'm getting

2717
01:50:13,800 --> 01:50:12,220
getting to do another project I'm

2718
01:50:15,930 --> 01:50:13,810
thinking more along the dramatic and

2719
01:50:17,580 --> 01:50:15,940
less documentary one Mike and I have

2720
01:50:19,560 --> 01:50:17,590
always talked about working together and

2721
01:50:21,480 --> 01:50:19,570
you know I'll make the plug if you're if

2722
01:50:23,550 --> 01:50:21,490
you're look them up on IMDB it's not

2723
01:50:26,010 --> 01:50:23,560
just you like me I don't just do UFOs

2724
01:50:27,840 --> 01:50:26,020
you did Barker VC didn't you Mike or you

2725
01:50:30,120 --> 01:50:27,850
were involved I did a documentary about

2726
01:50:32,460 --> 01:50:30,130
a world war one flying ace incredible

2727
01:50:34,830 --> 01:50:32,470
guy William berry 1930

2728
01:50:36,660 --> 01:50:34,840
yeah I'm interested in the paranormal

2729
01:50:37,470 --> 01:50:36,670
other than UFOs I'm interested in

2730
01:50:39,480 --> 01:50:37,480
theology

2731
01:50:40,410 --> 01:50:39,490
so I've done since that provision you

2732
01:50:41,920 --> 01:50:40,420
know what I'd really like to do

2733
01:50:45,130 --> 01:50:41,930
something is on

2734
01:50:46,390 --> 01:50:45,140
is on the operation apparitions really

2735
01:50:47,980 --> 01:50:46,400
just have Christians like the Blessed

2736
01:50:49,450 --> 01:50:47,990
Virgin Mary I think you're very

2737
01:50:52,210 --> 01:50:49,460
interested in doing something I'm Becky

2738
01:50:54,760 --> 01:50:52,220
Dorian that's sort of where my heart is

2739
01:50:56,500 --> 01:50:54,770
telling me to go right now the great

2740
01:50:57,970 --> 01:50:56,510
thing about it you know studying and

2741
01:51:00,670 --> 01:50:57,980
thinking about it making films like UFOs

2742
01:51:03,340 --> 01:51:00,680
for years New Year's is so I have that

2743
01:51:05,170 --> 01:51:03,350
information inside me and if I see any

2744
01:51:07,720 --> 01:51:05,180
interesting coincidences and the

2745
01:51:09,610 --> 01:51:07,730
research as I get to in the future I

2746
01:51:11,920 --> 01:51:09,620
have that experience to sort of draw on

2747
01:51:14,610 --> 01:51:11,930
so I'm really thankful for it but by the

2748
01:51:17,380 --> 01:51:14,620
same token I'm done thinking about UFOs

2749
01:51:21,490 --> 01:51:17,390
unless I see one I've been robbed and

2750
01:51:25,930 --> 01:51:21,500
seeing one for 48 years so III until I

2751
01:51:28,210 --> 01:51:25,940
see a UFO let me ask you just before

2752
01:51:30,220 --> 01:51:28,220
gene shuts us down one other thing that

2753
01:51:32,260 --> 01:51:30,230
you did you did the supernatural

2754
01:51:34,840 --> 01:51:32,270
investigator episode with Mack on life

2755
01:51:37,060 --> 01:51:34,850
on other planets but you yourself you

2756
01:51:40,960 --> 01:51:37,070
were actually the subject weren't you of

2757
01:51:43,840 --> 01:51:40,970
another episode on the Antichrist a

2758
01:51:45,730 --> 01:51:43,850
little investigation on the Antichrist

2759
01:51:49,090 --> 01:51:45,740
which was really an investigation in the

2760
01:51:51,220 --> 01:51:49,100
popular culture and theology and so we

2761
01:51:53,440 --> 01:51:51,230
met some interesting characters along

2762
01:51:55,210 --> 01:51:53,450
the way because it was very much a get

2763
01:51:58,780 --> 01:51:55,220
in there and talk to people kind of

2764
01:52:01,540 --> 01:51:58,790
documentary yeah holds a Miranda desu

2765
01:52:03,820 --> 01:52:01,550
check he says that he's you know the

2766
01:52:05,770 --> 01:52:03,830
price for eternity is it about eight

2767
01:52:09,610 --> 01:52:05,780
hundred thousand followers and you know

2768
01:52:13,060 --> 01:52:11,440
I was just gonna ask you having dealt

2769
01:52:15,160 --> 01:52:13,070
with people who sort of her into the

2770
01:52:17,890 --> 01:52:15,170
Antichrist and having dealt with people

2771
01:52:20,500 --> 01:52:17,900
who are into UFOs and met some of the

2772
01:52:22,480 --> 01:52:20,510
weirder people in the UFO field which

2773
01:52:24,400 --> 01:52:22,490
which is weirder you know this sort of

2774
01:52:26,590 --> 01:52:24,410
weirdos in the Antichrist thing or the

2775
01:52:28,540 --> 01:52:26,600
UFO weirdos and I don't mean everybody

2776
01:52:30,790 --> 01:52:28,550
in ufology is weirdo but I mean the

2777
01:52:33,340 --> 01:52:30,800
French I'm raising my hand I'm a weirdo

2778
01:52:34,990 --> 01:52:33,350
I plead guilty go ahead honestly have to

2779
01:52:36,910 --> 01:52:35,000
say that you know when it comes to UFOs

2780
01:52:40,540 --> 01:52:36,920
I think that believe it or not

2781
01:52:41,380 --> 01:52:40,550
saner people prevail compared to what

2782
01:52:47,770 --> 01:52:41,390
the Antichrist

2783
01:52:50,910 --> 01:52:47,780
things like that I I would stake the

2784
01:52:54,580 --> 01:52:50,920
UFOs if you don't feel like this

2785
01:52:57,490 --> 01:52:54,590
honestly I find that that a UFO ufology

2786
01:53:00,370 --> 01:52:57,500
you FRG has developed over the years and

2787
01:53:02,200 --> 01:53:00,380
that it is you know worthy of pursued

2788
01:53:04,240 --> 01:53:02,210
and more and more people who probably

2789
01:53:05,890 --> 01:53:04,250
wouldn't have associated with it before

2790
01:53:08,800 --> 01:53:05,900
in terms of research they're willing to

2791
01:53:10,810 --> 01:53:08,810
look at it and it's acknowledge that

2792
01:53:12,250 --> 01:53:10,820
something's going on when it comes to a

2793
01:53:13,840 --> 01:53:12,260
theological so Jay

2794
01:53:15,610 --> 01:53:13,850
there's a lot of personal hair and

2795
01:53:17,530 --> 01:53:15,620
feelings and emotions that come into

2796
01:53:19,720 --> 01:53:17,540
play and you get a lot more of a fringe

2797
01:53:23,320 --> 01:53:19,730
element quicker in terms of like basic

2798
01:53:25,450 --> 01:53:23,330
research the apology is more developed I

2799
01:53:27,400 --> 01:53:25,460
think are you researching the Antichrist

2800
01:53:29,920 --> 01:53:27,410
is there supposed to be such a character

2801
01:53:31,600 --> 01:53:29,930
or you're just looking well after what

2802
01:53:33,280 --> 01:53:31,610
the Catholic Church might say on the

2803
01:53:35,760 --> 01:53:33,290
subject well there's many writings for

2804
01:53:38,670 --> 01:53:35,770
the Antichrist is basically one of three

2805
01:53:40,990 --> 01:53:38,680
individuals that appear in the

2806
01:53:43,690 --> 01:53:41,000
revelation you know the other one is

2807
01:53:46,240 --> 01:53:43,700
also Satan themselves and the other one

2808
01:53:48,850 --> 01:53:46,250
is the false prophet so they work as a

2809
01:53:51,040 --> 01:53:48,860
sort of a triumvirate of evil which sort

2810
01:53:53,590 --> 01:53:51,050
of offsets the father sending the Holy

2811
01:53:56,050 --> 01:53:53,600
Spirit of the good so the Antichrist is

2812
01:53:58,930 --> 01:53:56,060
given a lot more sort of he's actually a

2813
01:54:00,400 --> 01:53:58,940
second-in-command to Satan when you look

2814
01:54:02,980 --> 01:54:00,410
at it from a theological point of view

2815
01:54:05,710 --> 01:54:02,990
but people automatically equate the

2816
01:54:10,090 --> 01:54:05,720
Antichrist ritzy when in actual fact is

2817
01:54:11,380 --> 01:54:10,100
more like Satan's first well they've

2818
01:54:13,420 --> 01:54:11,390
obviously never seen the devil's

2819
01:54:16,450 --> 01:54:13,430
advocate where Al Pacino plays Satan in

2820
01:54:19,480 --> 01:54:16,460
canto reeves plays the sort of incipient

2821
01:54:22,180 --> 01:54:19,490
antichrist beer when a is that so

2822
01:54:23,440 --> 01:54:22,190
odd because my my limited theological

2823
01:54:26,620 --> 01:54:23,450
understanding and i always get confused

2824
01:54:28,870 --> 01:54:26,630
about the Holy Trinity where God Jesus

2825
01:54:31,900 --> 01:54:28,880
and the Holy Spirit are separate yet the

2826
01:54:33,880 --> 01:54:31,910
same but really isn't Jesus sort of

2827
01:54:36,220 --> 01:54:33,890
God's number two if you sort of divvy

2828
01:54:37,960 --> 01:54:36,230
them up so if you have God and Satan at

2829
01:54:39,580 --> 01:54:37,970
the top then you've got the Antichrist

2830
01:54:41,080 --> 01:54:39,590
isn't the Antichrist sort of my

2831
01:54:46,690 --> 01:54:41,090
understanding always was the sort of

2832
01:54:49,330 --> 01:54:46,700
other side of Jesus a lot of people draw

2833
01:54:51,880 --> 01:54:49,340
that parallel and I think that arguments

2834
01:54:54,160 --> 01:54:51,890
to be made for that who was now when you

2835
01:54:56,170 --> 01:54:54,170
talk to people I would assume you might

2836
01:54:58,270 --> 01:54:56,180
have asked the question hey Frank

2837
01:55:01,510 --> 01:54:58,280
who's the Antichrist what was the

2838
01:55:04,090 --> 01:55:01,520
weirdest by atreya was one answer

2839
01:55:04,630 --> 01:55:04,100
there's a gentleman I met she's I'm

2840
01:55:05,650 --> 01:55:04,640
sorry

2841
01:55:07,360 --> 01:55:05,660
can't remember his name right off the

2842
01:55:11,080 --> 01:55:07,370
bat it'll come to me it looks like dee

2843
01:55:13,240 --> 01:55:11,090
dee Ramone Pastor Harry Walter and you

2844
01:55:15,310 --> 01:55:13,250
can find him on the Internet has to

2845
01:55:18,130 --> 01:55:15,320
Harry Walter he looks just like dee dee

2846
01:55:19,840 --> 01:55:18,140
Ramone and he is using a Hebrew

2847
01:55:22,540 --> 01:55:19,850
calculator because the Hebrew later said

2848
01:55:24,160 --> 01:55:22,550
numeric values and scourging to the

2849
01:55:26,170 --> 01:55:24,170
Bible with the Eber calculator he's

2850
01:55:29,830 --> 01:55:26,180
discovered that my atreya which is a

2851
01:55:31,510 --> 01:55:29,840
Buddhist deity of some sort is the true

2852
01:55:33,790 --> 01:55:31,520
Antichrist and that if you look at his

2853
01:55:35,560 --> 01:55:33,800
his face it looks just like the face on

2854
01:55:38,530 --> 01:55:35,570
Mars and if you look at the Sphinx it

2855
01:55:41,020 --> 01:55:38,540
looks like its face and you know yeah

2856
01:55:42,670 --> 01:55:41,030
and you know and that's you know you get

2857
01:55:46,120 --> 01:55:42,680
that right and you also get that in you

2858
01:55:47,110 --> 01:55:46,130
a whole field believe me do you know I

2859
01:55:49,210 --> 01:55:47,120
mean a lot of people would say that

2860
01:55:50,710 --> 01:55:49,220
field sprinkle is like you know going a

2861
01:55:51,910 --> 01:55:50,720
little bit too far in that direction and

2862
01:55:53,170 --> 01:55:51,920
you know what some of the stuff being

2863
01:55:55,390 --> 01:55:53,180
said in the interview that he didn't use

2864
01:56:00,040 --> 01:55:55,400
I don't know you know maybe maybe

2865
01:56:01,450 --> 01:56:00,050
wouldn't been said that 20 years ago the

2866
01:56:03,940 --> 01:56:01,460
great thing about doing interviews for

2867
01:56:05,980 --> 01:56:03,950
documentaries is all the stuff that you

2868
01:56:08,800 --> 01:56:05,990
see or in the u.s. you don't see on TV

2869
01:56:10,630 --> 01:56:08,810
there's 80 hours sometimes or 60 hours

2870
01:56:12,880 --> 01:56:10,640
of footage that we don't put in the film

2871
01:56:14,800 --> 01:56:12,890
for any one of a number of reasons so

2872
01:56:16,960 --> 01:56:14,810
I've got 18 hours of footage with Stan

2873
01:56:21,990 --> 01:56:16,970
Freedman when I did the Freedman film of

2874
01:56:26,050 --> 01:56:24,400
and never shuts up he's the best

2875
01:56:27,880 --> 01:56:26,060
interview ever and I say that all

2876
01:56:30,940 --> 01:56:27,890
affection you just turned the camera on

2877
01:56:32,530 --> 01:56:30,950
say go and every thirty minutes when the

2878
01:56:34,450 --> 01:56:32,540
tape would run out you'd stop him and

2879
01:56:36,700 --> 01:56:34,460
change tape but that was it so he's the

2880
01:56:38,560 --> 01:56:36,710
perfect interview but you know talking

2881
01:56:40,900 --> 01:56:38,570
about a whole range of things that

2882
01:56:42,610 --> 01:56:40,910
didn't fit the film would ever miss the

2883
01:56:44,590 --> 01:56:42,620
opportunity when you're sitting there as

2884
01:56:46,810 --> 01:56:44,600
a filmmaker with Stan or Kevin Randall

2885
01:56:48,490 --> 01:56:46,820
or Carl flock or whatever to not let the

2886
01:56:49,900 --> 01:56:48,500
camera keep rolling you know you know

2887
01:56:51,580 --> 01:56:49,910
it's not gonna make it in the film but

2888
01:56:52,900 --> 01:56:51,590
sure talk to me about this or talking

2889
01:56:55,300 --> 01:56:52,910
cuz you never know when you're gonna use

2890
01:56:57,130 --> 01:56:55,310
it down what I understand for the shaker

2891
01:56:59,560 --> 01:56:57,140
where you are whole incident I mean Stan

2892
01:57:02,170 --> 01:56:59,570
God was the guy who sort of said to

2893
01:57:04,090 --> 01:57:02,180
Chris Stiles listen young fella you're

2894
01:57:06,670 --> 01:57:04,100
onto something if you really want to

2895
01:57:08,350 --> 01:57:06,680
take this ball I you know I by endorse

2896
01:57:10,720 --> 01:57:08,360
that you should go for it and here's

2897
01:57:12,460 --> 01:57:10,730
what I suggest you do he's really great

2898
01:57:14,680 --> 01:57:12,470
that way absolutely

2899
01:57:16,930 --> 01:57:14,690
ya know he's a very yeah they both cited

2900
01:57:17,200 --> 01:57:16,940
him both Don and Chris as being the guy

2901
01:57:20,310 --> 01:57:17,210
who

2902
01:57:23,590 --> 01:57:20,320
push them to do a real investigation

2903
01:57:25,360 --> 01:57:23,600
what he said I'm sorry but the point of

2904
01:57:27,459 --> 01:57:25,370
what I was saying was that when I would

2905
01:57:30,459 --> 01:57:27,469
be here viewing him his thing is Roswell

2906
01:57:33,370 --> 01:57:30,469
and you know the other crash site and

2907
01:57:37,180 --> 01:57:33,380
that's his sort of thing and so I had to

2908
01:57:38,979 --> 01:57:37,190
take from his Roswell comment mostly the

2909
01:57:40,570 --> 01:57:38,989
reasoning as to prepare point of view

2910
01:57:42,940 --> 01:57:40,580
why this might happen because that's

2911
01:57:45,010 --> 01:57:42,950
what people want to know okay okay Mike

2912
01:57:47,350 --> 01:57:45,020
McDonald filmmaker so okay we're being

2913
01:57:49,900 --> 01:57:47,360
infiltrated by aliens but why it's it's

2914
01:57:51,760 --> 01:57:49,910
really not who than that is is why why

2915
01:57:54,100 --> 01:57:51,770
why am I here in this world you know

2916
01:57:56,020 --> 01:57:54,110
it's why and so that's what I try to get

2917
01:57:58,450 --> 01:57:56,030
these guys to tell me is the why and so

2918
01:58:02,440 --> 01:57:58,460
what Stan you know I definitely got like

2919
01:58:04,990 --> 01:58:02,450
50 to 1 more than I needed to talk about

2920
01:58:07,060 --> 01:58:05,000
jkirby knew a bit about Jake ever we're

2921
01:58:08,650 --> 01:58:07,070
just guys I'm gonna have to pull the

2922
01:58:11,890 --> 01:58:08,660
plug I have a little plug here you know

2923
01:58:16,150 --> 01:58:11,900
like there's like 10,000 volts each of

2924
01:58:19,930 --> 01:58:16,160
youth for your computers the trickster

2925
01:58:22,270 --> 01:58:19,940
again that was the trickster he just

2926
01:58:25,330 --> 01:58:22,280
came from the other show I'm the

2927
01:58:26,830 --> 01:58:25,340
trickster Michael McDonald how do we

2928
01:58:30,760 --> 01:58:26,840
find out more about the things you've

2929
01:58:32,979 --> 01:58:30,770
done you want to find out and tilt

2930
01:58:34,180 --> 01:58:32,989
invoice at gmail.com send me an email

2931
01:58:36,310 --> 01:58:34,190
ask me whatever

2932
01:58:38,770 --> 01:58:36,320
hey I'm work in Boise do you know about

2933
01:58:42,310 --> 01:58:38,780
Co okay Paul Kimball where can we find

2934
01:58:45,700 --> 01:58:42,320
your blog shredstar films all one word

2935
01:58:47,860 --> 01:58:45,710
dot blog spot.com and I will go to the

2936
01:58:49,930 --> 01:58:47,870
para cast forms I will encourage Mike to

2937
01:58:51,670 --> 01:58:49,940
sign up - you never know but I wouldn't

2938
01:58:53,560 --> 01:58:51,680
go to the para cast forms and I will put

2939
01:58:55,390 --> 01:58:53,570
a little thing up when the thing comes

2940
01:58:57,729 --> 01:58:55,400
on the show saying hey here's where you

2941
01:59:01,120 --> 01:58:57,739
can see mikesblog and his IMDB thing and

2942
01:59:03,910 --> 01:59:01,130
all that sort of stuff he's adding

2943
01:59:06,640 --> 01:59:03,920
himself he's joining forums doctor para

2944
01:59:08,229 --> 01:59:06,650
cast comm Michael McDonald thanks for

2945
01:59:10,390 --> 01:59:08,239
joining us in the para cast Paul

2946
01:59:14,260 --> 01:59:10,400
Campbell thanks as always for being a

2947
01:59:14,620 --> 01:59:14,270
great co-host thank you so much you too

2948
01:59:16,090 --> 01:59:14,630
Paul

2949
01:59:19,660 --> 01:59:16,100
see you saturday night for beers Mike

2950
01:59:24,050 --> 01:59:22,430
the pr cast is a copyrighted

2951
01:59:26,870 --> 01:59:24,060
presentation for making the impossible